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-   -   [TJ] 2010.02.24 - Sports (CD) [Album] (https://forums.electricmole.net/showthread.php?t=1410)

frecklegirl 2007.04.02 02:39 PM

[TJ] 2010.02.24 - Sports (CD) [Album]
 
スポーツ (Sports)


01. 生きる (Ikiru)
02. 電波通信 (Denpa Tsuushin)
03. シーズンサヨナラ (Season Sayonara)
04. 勝ち戦 (Kachi-ikusa)
05. FOUL
06. 雨天決行 (Utenkekkou)
07. 能動的三分間 (Noudouteki Sanpunkan)
08. 絶体絶命 (Zettai Zetsumei)
09. FAIR
10. 乗り気 (Noriki)
11. スイートスポット (Sweet Spot)
12. 閃光少女 (Senkou Shoujo)
13. 極まる(きまる) (Kimaru)
Total Playtime:

Second-Press Availability: Amazon.co.jp, CD Japan, HMV Japan, YesAsia

crab0021 2010.02.09 05:31 PM

Well, nobody will be disappointed. The album is great. The opening and closing tracks will blow your minds, especially the vocal harmony opener on track 1, amazing! FAIR is prob my fave song, a relaxed, groovy tune not unlike Adult mixed with the better parts of Variety.

bromithia 2010.02.09 07:44 PM

Well, it's better than Variety in my book. I think the opening and ending tracks are the best parts.

fluffiethesock 2010.02.09 08:13 PM

Just for easy reference:

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuro_neko (Post 66298)
01. ikiru words by ringo music by izawa
02. denpa tsuushin words by ringo music by izawa
03. season sayonara words and music by ukigumo
04. kachiikusa words and music by ringo
05. FOUL words and music by ukigumo
06. utenkekkou words by ringo music by izawa
07. noudoutekisanpunkan words and music by ringo
08. zettai zetsumei words by ringo music by ringo and izawa
09. FAIR words by Ringo and music by Ukigumo
10. noriki words by ringo and music by izawa
11. sweet spot words by ringo music by ringo and izawa
12. senkou shoujo words by ringo music by kameda
13. kimaru workd and music by ukigumo


kuro_neko 2010.02.09 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fluffiethesock (Post 67360)
Just for easy reference:

ALLEGEDLY PEOPLE, ALLEGEDLY

lol, no, seriously, those are just from 2ch, there has been no official composition credits listed yet, we will probably have to wait for the physical album first.

Scribble R 2010.02.10 12:10 AM

Some of the songs are characteristic of the alleged composers so I believe it 100 per cent at this point...(Well, I can't understand lyrics)

Dunno what I think about the album, but highlights: Ikiru, Denpa Tsuushin, Zettai Zetsumei, Kimaru

gekokujyo 2010.02.10 03:37 AM

What a quintessential kayoukyoku album!

It's definitely a lot tighter than VARIETY, to anybody who is concerned. 'ikiru' is probably my favourite new track (are those the guys in the band harmonising?!). I am gonna confess that I have trouble recalling the rest of the songs even though I have the impression of them being really awesome ("Wow, this is really good!") when I'm listening to them. I'm gonna attribute this to the fact that I've had less than 10 hours of sleep across the last 3 days, so I've really been lingering on the edge of dreamland on the bus while I listened to this.

I know this sounds like a really cheap way of describing the album, but I do feel on many levels that this is a nice synthesis of their first 3 albums - it has the grittiness of Kyouiku, the restraint and precision of ADULT, and the whimsy of VARIETY.

Ringo~Bingo 2010.02.10 03:43 AM

The albums not that bad but it's not blowing me away. :( I thought "Ikiru" was intresting but found "Denpa Tsuushin" utterly dire. :P
"Zettai Zetsumei" is alright-ish, however I cannot stand "Sweet Spot" at all, something about it makes it unlistenable to me.

I wouldn't call the majority of it essential listening (it's kinda dull) but it's better than Variety so at least it's a step up.

Edit: I've listened to the album in full four times now then just deleted it from my hard drive. It's not for me. :(

BanFan 2010.02.10 06:42 AM

Round One: "Ikiru" is kind of nuts, though I don't know if I actually like it, and "Uttenkekkou" and "Kimaru" are pretty good. Other than those tracks, nothing else really stood out to me. I got pretty bored by "Zettai Zetsumei". It's a strong contender for my least favorite Tokyo Jihen album.

nayth 2010.02.10 07:59 AM

I really hated Variety, this new album mixes a lot of 'Jpop' with the tokyo jihen flavour... and I really love it ! (this is first listen impression though, hope it will last longer than that)

Tracks that have caught my ear :) : Ikiru, Denpa Tsuushin, Utenkekkou, Noudouteki Sanpunkan, Zettai Zetsumei, Noriki, Senkou Shoujo

I already listened the album around five, six times, I'm a big fan :p

this is drawings I've done while listening it's kind of a graphic review :
My graphic review !

lazer85 2010.02.10 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scribble R (Post 67369)
Dunno what I think about the album, but highlights: Ikiru, Denpa Tsuushin, Zettai Zetsumei, Kimaru


Basically the same....exactly. Plus I finally fell in love with 3pun now that the pressure is off and I know it isnt the best song on the album. and senkou shojo rocks too

I haven't sat down and tried to understand all the lyrics but what I could understand sounded pretty amazing and pretty ringo. ill try to understand them better tomorrow.

lazer85 2010.02.10 08:23 AM

ive said this in emails to a few people already but I really think the album is what Variety wanted to be. It seems to be coming from the exact same place as far as style and artistic vision but its not nearly as sloppy and most everything about it is better (AND NO FUKUSHUU!!!). The opening song sounds like an opening song (and is great.....an opening song HAS to be great!). The ending song sounds like an ending song. The songs sound like the whole band was involved in them and not just the member who wrote it. The album sounds like ringo was involed again and not in her comeback-in-a-hurry mode. Variety wasnt nearly as bad as we all made it out to be, but whatever you say about it, it was a MESS.

I could actually imagine a lot (most?)of these songs being on variety but for the most part they are better.

And nayth welcome to the boards, your art is pretty f-ing cool

Scribble R 2010.02.10 09:27 AM

I like your art, nayth.

It did occur to me that this sounds very J-Poppy in places. I do agree with lazer in that Sports sounds like it's less about who composed what (Although certain members' idiosyncracies do pop up here and there, naturally)

Least favourite tracks so far: FAIR and Noriki, although there are segments in each song that I like.

Is it wrong that I like FOUL? Crawl/BB Queen comparisons aside, it reminds me of Dr.Robotnik... =X

letemp 2010.02.10 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nayth (Post 67395)
I really hated Variety, this new album mixes a lot of 'Jpop' with the tokyo jihen flavour... and I really love it ! (this is first listen impression though, hope it will last longer than that)

Tracks that have caught my ear :) : Ikiru, Denpa Tsuushin, Utenkekkou, Noudouteki Sanpunkan, Zettai Zetsumei, Noriki, Senkou Shoujo

I already listened the album around five, six times, I'm a big fan :p

this is drawings I've done while listening it's kind of a graphic review :
My graphic review !

beautiful review!!❤

bromithia 2010.02.10 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scribble R
Least favourite tracks so far: FAIR and Noriki

Yeahh, I'm thinking Noriki is the worst track on the album, with FOUL coming at a close second... but maybe they will grow on me.

Positron 2010.02.10 09:47 AM

While stuck in the snow for the sixth day in a row, I contemplated pre-ordering Sports before first-press disappeared. In the process of checking out all the information, I stumbled across Glath's discovery of the album leak, and I could not help myself since going in blind would be a ~$40 gamble...


I like the idea of Ikiru, but the "background noise" in the first half can be a bit much, while the second half seems harder to get behind for some reason.

Denpa Tsuushin honestly sounds like it could be the theme music for Sonic 4, or at least a BGM. Whether or not that's a good thing is up to you.

Season Sayonara sounds solid, so simply saying such should suffice. (I could go further with the s, but it'd be painful for all us sans schadenfreude.)

It feels like Kachi-ikusa was a Variety holdover that snuck onto the album, while FOUL was an extra from Shouso Strip.

Utenkekku? Eh.

Whatever your feelings on Noudouteki Sanpunkan are probably won't change with its release, but it does fit well in the middle of the album.

Zettai Zetsumei is pleasant but not great. I'd feel different about it if she didn't keep the lighter tone in just the first half and spread it out a bit throughout the song.

FAIR will probably accurately describe how most people feel about the song, but I'm a fan of the style.

Noriki feels too much like a mediocre anime theme that segues into a lame video game segment in the middle of the song.

Sweet Spot
is Karada-level cheesy (so of course I like it, haha).

Senkou Shoujo
: see Noudouteki Sanpunkan, except that it now benefits more from being put somewhere on an album, fitting in very well as the second-to-last track.

Kimaru wants to be the Souretsu of Sports but doesn't match up with the rest of album well enough to gain that title.


Some of the statements here seem a bit ridiculous, and rightfully so.

madpawn 2010.02.10 11:18 AM

They're an actual band now! I'm so proud of them.

Orenji 2010.02.10 01:36 PM

I'm lovin' it so far... Ikiru and Kimaru are like TJ's Shuukyou/Souretsu, I'm kinda impressed with them... The rest of the album is basically pop, but I'm not disappointed at all. The only song I don't really like is Uten Kekkou, which is simply boring... Maybe it will grow on me, but it's the song I'm not really into. The highlights are Ikiru, Denpa Tsuushin, FOUL, 3min and Noriki, but the rest is great as well ^^. I'm so glad this is not Variety II...

TeslaGuy 2010.02.10 03:09 PM

Still in the middle of my first listen. Kind of feel ho-hum. Its just not fascinating, arresting or amazing. Really good work by all, but just not extra special... at least not yet. My opinion will undoubtably change.

kuro_neko 2010.02.10 03:38 PM

out of curiosity, are we all listening to the leak that was posted in private circles which made its way to jpopsuki? I compared 3min on the supposedly 192 to my personal file and the difference in sound was atrocious, there is no way that the source files were ripped to 192, if I had to guess I'd say it was even LESS than 100, probably around 60 or so, I have heard similar files that sound similar compression wise.

Mr Sands 2010.02.10 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nayth (Post 67395)

this is drawings I've done while listening it's kind of a graphic review :
My graphic review !


I love this idea! Not quite sure what is going on in the drawing, but I like it...

Yahiko 2010.02.10 05:28 PM

I'm touched ;____;

the album is awesome

Ikiru (08/10): I love the background effects, they're creepy! And then the song goes weird, and comes back to all the goodness.. it's so weird :)

Denpa Tsuushin (09/10): GAMAN!!!!!!! Love the chorus :DD

Season Sayounara (07/10): What's wrong? The song is awesome, but where is the chorus? If there's one, it's no strong nor catchy. But I love it afterall

Kachi-ikusa (07/10): Fever blahh. I like it, but who cares about early leaked songs when you have a bunch of new songs? :D

FOUL (09/10): The megaphone song on SPORTS! I love all of them, it could not be different to this one !

Uttenkekkou (05/10): Couldn't believe it was written by Ringozawa... don't really like it

Noudouteki Sanpunkan (09/10): Still love it ;D

Zettai Zetsumei (10/10): YES!!!!!!!!! THIS IS TRUE RINGOZAWA WORK! ;__; It's so CUTE! and and aww... That's what you could get if you mix Amagasa with Killertune :D

FAIR (06/10): It has everything to be the best song on the album.. but it just don't work anymore for me... It's a good song though :)

Noriki (07/10): I like the chorus

Sweet Spot (08/10): Woo! This song is really good, but the chorus are not SO cool as the verses .. this is happening a lot in this album

Senkou Shoujo (09/10): The only Kameda work... good enough, I like him but I would not want to have another shiseikatsu, SShoujo is fine for me :D

Kimaru (10/10): This kind of makes me remember of Ichijiku no Hana (it has also the same composer, allegedly)... it scares me, true. I loved this song... Best Opening and Closing tracks couple


Overall, It's one of my favorite TJ albums :) it's really really nice!

imkookoo 2010.02.10 06:13 PM

I was going to post my review of the album, but I don't have much to say that's already been said. Ikiru and Kimaru are both very epic songs that have a lot of atmosphere. If the rest of the album matched the same amount of experimentalism and emotion, this album would have surpassed Adult for me, but I feel the songs in the middle are kind of bland. Some of them are listenable, but they don't strike a chord in me.

Definitely more cohesive and more refined than Variety, though.

lazer85 2010.02.10 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orenji (Post 67413)
I'm lovin' it so far... Ikiru and Kimaru are like TJ's Shuukyou/Souretsu, I'm kinda impressed with them... The rest of the album is basically pop, but I'm not disappointed at all. The only song I don't really like is Uten Kekkou, which is simply boring... .

cool comparison, I thought souretsu after 5 seconds of the album and was like 'NO!!!! SHE COULDNT DO THAT AGAIN!", that song is like the pinnicle of music for me, but after listening I realized it had Jihen written all over it which is good because theres no such thing as a song like souretsu but better, the best they could do is almost as good.

I agree on Utten. I'm pretty sure that 5 and 6 will be my superstar of this album (but better cause I CAN listen to them) which means I might skip them when I'm not in the mood for the flow of the album. I never like these kinds of songs. And FOUL is just TOO Crawl for me, it doesnt feel new for a band that jumps between styles so readily. Neither are bad but they dont match up for me. I hate to make judgements like this without having full quality (at least for FOUL, I'm 100% sure I wont come to like utten much more). oh well

The one thing I'm not agreeing with is the hate for noriki....I get it because it sounds like it would fit perfectly on variety but its still catchy and is probably one of the 5 songs that feels like they tried something new.

lazer85 2010.02.10 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuro_neko (Post 67419)
out of curiosity, are we all listening to the leak that was posted in private circles which made its way to jpopsuki? I compared 3min on the supposedly 192 to my personal file and the difference in sound was atrocious, there is no way that the source files were ripped to 192, if I had to guess I'd say it was even LESS than 100, probably around 60 or so, I have heard similar files that sound similar compression wise.

I havent listened to the jpopsuki one yet but the file sizes are all the same which I guess means its the same one? If it were different I'd expect at least a few KBs difference per song, at least if the old 192 wasnt actually 192 they should be different. And you make it sound like anyone who got it early was in some kind of club or keeping it from other people. I just went to last fm and said to two people 'Hey give me the damn album or I'm going to bite my hand until I bleed' and poof there it was.

I guess you listened!

kuro_neko 2010.02.10 07:20 PM

I haven't listened. I downloaded the leak and compared 3min with my personal rip of the single and senkou shoujo with my copy. it sounded terrible so I didn't bother to listen to the entire leak, I just skimmed through denpa tsuushin, liked what I heard, didn't want to spoil the rest, and put it away. its still on my HD but I probably won't listen to it. the leak of Adult was similar, as Glath has mentioned, and some members really regret it.

that being said, this wasn't always on jpopsuki. I know you just PMed on last.fm and they gave it to you, but that isn't the way it works on the forum. you weren't around and don't have a name for yourself, but considering my personal history with one member in particular, who, as far as I can trace, is the source of the leak to others at last.fm and eventually jpopsuki and this forum, I doubt if I personally asked they would have shared it with me. it got ugly during HF, Variety, and SG. Hell, HF was half the reason why the old forums closed and the new ones opened. point being, it doesn't happen like this often, it usually is a small group of people who manage to get the album who decide who is and who isn't cool enough to share with. fortunately there are enough members on last.fm and enough new members here who are ignorant of release history, so no worries this time around.

letemp 2010.02.10 07:21 PM

i think Uttenkekkou is a cute song

ChickShhh 2010.02.10 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letemp (Post 67430)
i think Uttenkekkou is a cute song

x2, much better than Futarixxx Jikan

Izawa wants to play like HZM in season sayonara...

ichenyy 2010.02.10 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scribble R (Post 67369)
Some of the songs are characteristic of the alleged composers so I believe it 100 per cent at this point...(Well, I can't understand lyrics)

i have a feeling that the credits are pretty much correct...

Before looking at the credits, when i listened to 05 FOUL, i was like "this must be uki", and when i listened to 06 utenkekkou and 08. zettai zetsumei i felt that they must be izawa compositions

edit:Utenkekkou(雨天決行) and Zettai Zetsumei(絶体絶命)are cute:D

lazer85 2010.02.10 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuro_neko (Post 67429)
I haven't listened. I downloaded the leak and compared 3min with my personal rip of the single and senkou shoujo with my copy. it sounded terrible so I didn't bother to listen to the entire leak, I just skimmed through denpa tsuushin, liked what I heard, didn't want to spoil the rest, and put it away. its still on my HD but I probably won't listen to it. the leak of Adult was similar, as Glath has mentioned, and some members really regret it.

that being said, this wasn't always on jpopsuki. I know you just PMed on last.fm and they gave it to you, but that isn't the way it works on the forum. you weren't around and don't have a name for yourself, but considering my personal history with one member in particular, who, as far as I can trace, is the source of the leak to others at last.fm and eventually jpopsuki and this forum, I doubt if I personally asked they would have shared it with me. it got ugly during HF, Variety, and SG. Hell, HF was half the reason why the old forums closed and the new ones opened. point being, it doesn't happen like this often, it usually is a small group of people who manage to get the album who decide who is and who isn't cool enough to share with. fortunately there are enough members on last.fm and enough new members here who are ignorant of release history, so no worries this time around.


I was here for variety and SG. you just didnt notice me and I think it was just one person who was playing pick and choose, but obviously they picked enough people for it to spread around and the only reason it seemed to cause problems is because they were hell bent on talking about it here despite playing pick and choose. This time that person obviously didnt want to cause problems on the board. And the circle wasnt a circle, it was a pyramid, people closer to the source of it were more worried about getting someone in trouble by letting everyone hear it but wanted to share it with SOMEONE and with every time it got passed along 3 or 4 or 10 degrees nobody cared anymore, i think this is something that happens with a lot of leaks, how dramatic the fanbase is varies though. I dont see why it cant always work the way it did this time from now on. Theres a ban on talking about it until its reached that degree when anyone can find it if they work ask around and then the discussion of it is limited to one thread. I think its good days from here on out if no one lets their underwear get too tight.

justriiingo 2010.02.10 11:04 PM

As usual, I don't have much nice things to say about this album. The sound is very generic Jpop, and there's nothing truly original about the material on this album. Well, maybe autotune Ukizawa on the opening track, which is truly truly truly ghastly. Otherwise, all the sounds we've heard elsewhere from other artists.

Listenable tracks:
#3 シーズンサヨナラ. This would be what I call nice mainstream pop. That's a nice little solo that Izawa did. However, it feels like anyone else can sing the melody and it wouldn't make a difference. You can put one of the Perfume girls on autotune on vocals, and it would probably still work. It's not "special" to TJ, but still a solid track.

#8 絶体絶命 Also another nice mainstream pop sound. Probably the most Ringo sounding out of all the tracks on it, though I can hear the Izawa in there too. I don't like the piano sound on this; it sounds too Sesame Street/cartoonish. But otherwise this is a really enjoyable tune.

#9 FAIR. I like it when Uki writes R&B tracks. He has even written himself a rather successful solo bit. Definitely a direction worth exploring.

Probably will not listen to this album ever again. The sound is so generic any other band could have reproduced it quite easily. Also, the emotional range of this album is that of a 14 yr old kid. It kinda trods along the innocent happy-sad continuum; it doesn't have the intensity or complexity of ... 30 yr old emotions, which incidentally, is the median age of the band members. It just feels dumbed down for me.

This will be a successful pop album and will make TJ very very rich.
Congratulations.

kuro_neko 2010.02.11 12:18 AM

its always the same group of people (who don't need to be named) and they share amongst themselves and the only reason why this time is different is because there is a community of jihen listeners on last.fm who either lurk here or simply don't come here, so they are largely ignorant of the shark feeding that happens each release, and being friends with certain ex-members, they have access to the material and share it. I mean if someone was stupid enough to upload it to jpopsuki, that says enough right there. that is why I asked if it was the same source as that which was being shared privately in small circles. some people got it from jpopsuki, some people (like you lazer), got it from others. In the end it must come from the same source, as you mentioned. I guess someone was just stupid enough to put it up on jpopsuki, I hope no one looses their job if this came from a promo...

justriingo, your post made me laugh (probably not intentionally either). if your going to write off the album as having the emotional range of a kid, you might want to wait for a leak that is high quality enough to actually decipher the lyrics (assuming you speak japanese). good job, per usual

EVH 2010.02.11 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justriiingo (Post 67436)
it doesn't have the intensity or complexity of ... 30 yr old emotions, which incidentally, is the median age of the band members.

Maths Nazi time. If all the members are over 30 years of age the median value is NOT 30.

so_cold 2010.02.11 03:30 AM

If having a median age of over 30 means something, maybe it should mean spreading the creative wings a la Tamatebako. I want SR to develop her rich gift for melody, not go into a more mainstream sound. After listening, I can only remember two of the new tunes at the moment: Zettai Zetsumei and Sweet Spot. The autotune intro to Ikiru is unlistenable. Actually this album might be experimental, but I probably don't know or like the J-pop acts they're referencing, I guess I'm at a disadvantage.

@kuro_neko: Would you listen to a pneumatic drill if the lyrics were good? Maybe you'd find it jarring in an interesting way. We get that you're not listening to a poor quality leak (laudable, especially if a band are interviewed as refining their groove, the final CD garage quality didn't help Kyoiku in that regard), but the tunes are not a patch on what is right to expect from an SR-related project. Most multilingual people I know don't go on about it like you do. You pick on one poster, but JR is the one person who posted what I felt on first listening to TJ, and has a much, much better taste in music than you. No offence and all.

Might post more later, I like a couple of songs (Zettai Zetsumei's really swinging) but I'm not sure there's enough of an album to go on.

lazer85 2010.02.11 04:23 AM

Why is it that the native english speakers here have much poorer english than the non-native english speakers?

I guess I'm not an exception


kuro- if you need to know i talked to who you seem to think is the source, he said no but I'm sure if i pressed him with kindness he would have given it to me but at that time I had already found it. I dont think its as malicious as you think it is.

Just out of curiousity, what turns you on these days justringo? I get it if someone doesnt dig this album, but I dont really get your reasons at all. I don't really get how you could say 'any other band could produce this'....even if this album is shit, I dont really think thats a valid statement. I don't see how any of these songs aside from the singles and one or two more would stike a chord with the mainstream, I mean talk shit on ikiru all you want, its not going to make this band the next perfume or raise them to the heights of popularity that ringo was during SS. I'm sure this band could have produced 13 tracks that the majority of people would like much more than these. And honestly, what emotional complexities does a 30 year old feel that a 14 doesn't other than feeling stressed or jaded? While they may be more capable of experiencing...30 year olds dont usually seem to be thinking or feeling much more than their children and sometimes much much less. I get how this is less complex than KZK but don't you think releasing something like that could have been her letting out all the emotion she could muster up at once and after it she just wanted to enjoy making music and challenging herself in ways that arent as pleasing to.....you. Innovation aside (honestly how many times can an artist have 10-15 songs with 10-15 styles....theres nothing wrong with exploring the same style in a few different ways. This album seemed to me like it had artistic intent, possibly the most we've seen since KZK (HF maybe?) so I'm not really buying your argument.


Maybe if I knew what kind of music you were into, I could see where you were coming from. But right now you just sound like an unpleasant person whose exaggerating their negative opinion to try and counter the many positive opinions (which I guess I can relate to in a way....I talk lots of shit about radiohead when I actually kind of like them)

Inaudible-Whisper 2010.02.11 06:37 AM

Nearly finished my first listen. I avoided getting caught up in pre-release discussion and hype to avoid disappointment, which seems to have worked in my favour. It's not fantastic, but I'm pleasantly surprised. I've enjoyed listening to a few songs so far. It'll take a few more listens to really decide just how good it is, which songs stand out and if it has any kind of longevity but I'm willing to give it more of a chance than I did Variety. Admittedly it's starting to lose momentum, let's hope it picks up again at the end.

justriiingo 2010.02.11 08:07 AM

First of all, why do people see only the negative things I post.
I actually said this album had 3 solid tunes, albeit not solid in the old SR manner. Nobody's going to agree with me that those 3 tunes are good? Nobody's going to applaud Uki (and everyone knows I can't stand that dude) on writing a successful R&B tune? Don't call me a hater when all you read is the negative part of my posts. Also, calling an album "generic" is not the same as calling an album "shit". Taking generic drugs isn't the same as eating shit. Get your facts right before you trod all over me.

I listen to this album, and I don't feel Tokyo Jihen at all. Instead, I hear bands like Every Little Thing, The Brilliant Green, DAI, especially in beginning, more rock parts of the album. (Sorry the references are so old, I haven't been bothered to listen to Jpop in a while.) This is what I mean by any band could have made this album. Old SR/TJ tunes had that special quality where if you made someone else do the vocals, it would sound totally wrong. Utada Hikaru tried to imitate Tsumi to Batsu at one of her concerts before. She did a great imitation, but the feel is essentially Utada, not SR. However here you can put Mika Nakashima, Ai Otsuka, or even one of the PERFUME girls on vox, and no one would think, no that's not right. This is the point that I want to get across. A band should make their tracks feel special. A vocalist should own her melody, impart her life into the tune. It doesn't feel like it here. It feels detached. And no, I don't need lyrics to tell me that. I don't even need good quality audio to convey that to me. SR's demos weren't exactly audiophile material but you can hear the passion, sincerity, the drive. You don't hear that anymore.

If you want to know what I listen to, head over to the CLT thread. I put stuff I like in there. Admittedly, no one's commented on it, so I take it that no one has really taken to the sound. That's okay. But if you really want to know the yardstick in which I judge TJ, there is José James, and Air (no, not the french electronic duo). SR used to write the kind of songs which have the same emotional weight as the Air tune. Not anymore.

gekokujyo 2010.02.11 08:41 AM

Eh? I dunno, I think Mika or Ai would sound pretty darn weird singing any of the songs on this album. But maybe that's just me, man. Shrug.

I've had it on repeat all day - I've decided that I can't really stand FOUL, and that FAIR's a little wishy washy for my liking, but everything else has a really great vibe going on. Even the cute like fuck Utten-something. I thought at the beginning that was really clear that ikiru was superior to kimaru, and had no idea what everyone else was smoking when they jizzed over it, but now that I've allowed it to seep through 5 or 6 listens over the entire day, I'm really starting to 'get' it. Again, I'm sure nobody's gonna agree with me, but I'd have sex to most of this album.

letemp 2010.02.11 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justriiingo (Post 67436)
Probably will not listen to this album ever again.

!!! seriously !?!

Ringo~Bingo 2010.02.11 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letemp (Post 67446)
!!! seriously !?!

I agree with her. :) Just because it's Tokyo Jihen it doesn't mean it deserves any more of a listen than any other album you don't like. I don't think it's up to much and I don't need to be a kanji lord or audiophile to reach that conclusion, it just sounds dull and forgettable to me. :(

I probably don't have the best music taste on Earth but I know what I like and this is not it.

Scribble R 2010.02.11 11:20 AM

After my first listen, I said to a few EMFers that I didn't know what I thought of the album...except that it sounded like it was created by a different band, and that it might not be received well on EMF because -- I'M GUESSING -- people signed up for Ringo's particular brand of music and not necessarily Saito Neko/Hirama/HZM/Ukigumo/Izawa's. So when the other musicians get thrown into the mix and dilute Ringo to the point where the most Ringo-sounding track is the exception, people's opinions are obviously going to separate, because the common ground just gave way.

Regardless of whether I find the album good or not (I need to listen to it a few more times, maybe when the album is released officially.), it's still lacking Ringo's idiosyncrasies. Which sucks, because I don't think any musician can fill that Ringo-shaped hole, regardless of how 'good' their music is.

I guess this will only make me become more disillusioned, but if the whole communist Tokyo Jihen thing is making Ringo happy, then it's the best thing she could be doing. An immature part of me wants to hate SR for being selfish with her recent decision to just SUDDENLY ABANDON pre-Variety/Adult music (She didn't even begin to milk her different styles before moving on! Album-wise, I mean), but yeah, she's an individual with a life and not a machine soooooo

justriiingo 2010.02.11 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letemp (Post 67446)
!!! seriously !?!

Yes, seriously.

Goes back listening to HASYMO. (I really dig how they updated the tracks so it sounds like from the 00s).

so_cold 2010.02.11 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justriiingo (Post 67444)
Old SR/TJ tunes had that special quality where if you made someone else do the vocals, it would sound totally wrong

Tomosaka Rie :lol:. She can't sing like SR can, but I accepted Shoujo Robot and Cappuccino as being Ringo long before I gave TJ or HF the time of day...

(Mini Review) Sorry for the retro-edit. Just wanted this post to read more gracefully. I guess I didn't like Ukizawa's singing on Gaman to start with so the creative autotuning on Ikiru (into cadences or something...!) was way too much. I really don't like 1, 4-6, 10 or how 2 or 13 end, and don't want to listen again for whatever reason.

Otherwise I liked these songs, in descending order of playcount. They make an enjoyable EP:

#8 Zettai Zetsumei: This is cute, I agree. Cool disco beats, the melody's a bit repetitive, but lots of harmonies that draw me.

#11 Sweet Spot: Slight surprise this came second, but I do think it's the strongest melody on the album, and I guess I just like the R&B. I love it when SR does background wails and rhodes pianos do pretty things (towards the end). It's got those chords I like. I have issues with the instrumental break and I'm not fully sold on Ringo's diva singing (particularly in comparison to the excellent performance for Shun). But it calls to mind autumn colours and Mary J Blige's You Gotta Believe (a good thing in my world haha).

#9 FAIR: I can just tune out and enjoy this. It's such a Uki vanity project, but where it finds a melody in the chorus it's an album highlight.

#3 Season Sayonara: Likeable Shibuya-kei ish cousin to Kingyo no Hako. I think anybody could perform this as well but they'd need to rope Izawa in because his soloing's fun.

kuro_neko 2010.02.11 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by so_cold (Post 67441)
@kuro_neko: Would you listen to a pneumatic drill if the lyrics were good? Maybe you'd find it jarring in an interesting way. We get that you're not listening to a poor quality leak (laudable, especially if a band are interviewed as refining their groove, the final CD garage quality didn't help Kyoiku in that regard), but the tunes are not a patch on what is right to expect from an SR-related project. Most multilingual people I know don't go on about it like you do. You pick on one poster, but JR is the one person who posted what I felt on first listening to TJ, and has a much, much better taste in music than you. No offence and all.

I could really care less if you or justriingo or anyone dislikes the album, and if you want to dl a shitty leak and make judgements on that, thats fine. my comment was referencing the fact that justriingo thinks the album has no emotional range, especially considering the collective ages of the band members. my comment is referencing the fact that, well, that is an interesting accusation, considering at this point lyrics are not even speculated about yet, let alone translated for people who don't speak japanese. I'm not going to pretend that I listen to a Ringo song and it 100% unfolds for me, it takes effort to sit down with the lyrics to decipher them usually. that is why when you guys go on about this being your typical jpop shit its like, are you kidding me? I can 100 percent understand an Utada song or an Ayu song, without lyrics in front of me, from one listen. Not the same with Ringo. Ringo creates work with depth, but that is getting off the point. my point is how can you judge the emotional range of a work when you can't even tell what the singer is *singing about*. You can gauge emotion from the music and the way it makes you feel, but you could be singing satire, you could sound one way and sing another, which Ringo has done, she has happy songs that are really depressing and sad songs which aren't nearly as much so you'd think. point being, don't judge a book by its cover, and at this point, I consider the leak one large shitty quality cover for the album. it gives you insight and a first glimpse, but I don't expect to understand the album until I have my personal copy, the lyric book, and a good week of listening and letting it settle.

justriingo your comments are why you find the emotional range lacking are interesting. I can't really say what is going on with her in this album, but I do know that with SG and even with Variety, there is no way you could stick another singer in Ringo's place and have it work. The reason why older Ringo seems that way is because she was fresh and biting at the chomp to prove herself. She is a confident mature mother now and she doesn't need to wail and scream and roll her r's and try and separate her vocals from the rest of the industry's because she has come this far. You may not like that, but I like how well-rounded she has become. If you want to listen to songs like Tsumi to Batsu and hear the passion and naivety in the early demos, well, they are there waiting for you. Gauging the Japanese fans response, they couldn't disagree more, it seems like with each song they hear they are screaming things like "only tokyo jihen" etc etc. to each his own.

lazer85 2010.02.11 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justriiingo (Post 67444)
Old SR/TJ tunes had that special quality where if you made someone else do the vocals, it would sound totally wrong.

Haha why only see the negative? It was like....."This album is ew....These songs dont make me wanna kill myself though". You wanna have a conversation of YEAH I AGREE WITH YOU's over that? haha of course not. I'm trying to rethink and make you rethink and the only reason I need to tell anyone I agree with them is if its 100% dead on with my opinion like scribbles choice in songs from the album or if I want to add something to what someone said. Most discussion isn't really agreeing or disagreeing but you were the first extremely negative opinion about the album and I think it needs to be challanged the same way we all need to be challenged for saying the same good things about the album.

Statement makes a whole lot more sense to me, I can completely see where its coming from. I have to admit I can totally imagine someone doing a decent cover of sweet spot and maybe 2 other songs (Still wouldnt sound as good) and I could probably imagine a good indie artist doing better-than-the-original covers of zettai zetsumei and another song or two. The generic.....if thats what you think I can respect that. But I guess I'm not going to understand the comparisons, I can't imagine any of the bands you listed doing at least half of these songs, and even if they did the other half, it probably would sound a lot worse.

If I heard an old ringo song on a MIDI file without knowing it, I might be able to guess it was ringo from the melody and now I could not. Is that a bad thing or a good thing I dont know? It could mean shes too diverse now or it could mean shes lost something....probably a bit of both. Am I in love with the new album, I'm not sure, but I think it deserves at least a few listens on full quality....it isnt bad enough for me to deny it that and I suspect I will continue to like the 6 or so songs I like and have half of the others grow on me with the remaining 3 be decent filler between the good songs. Is it old ringo no? But I dont think its nearly as generic as you make it out to be anyway.

Scribble R 2010.02.11 02:45 PM

It's not generic. People get over-excited with that term nowadays.

Yahiko 2010.02.11 03:55 PM

hahaha I just mixed Zettai Zetsumei with Killer Tune.. and they sound awesome together :D


I just noticed they scream F A I R and F O U L both on FOUL :D

BanFan 2010.02.11 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justriiingo (Post 67436)
I listen to this album, and I don't feel Tokyo Jihen at all.

My opinion may or may not make sense (since I actually really liked Variety), but that's exactly how I feel. Something about this album feels really off, kind of like it's an album of b-side demos.

I won't be giving this album a third try anytime soon, since I doubt anything from it will grow on me like the SG songs did.

Nimh 2010.02.11 05:51 PM

Anything less than a 4-minute banshee wail from Ringo followed by a 3-minute atonal guitar riff that shrieks into oblivion will fall under the category of "generic" for a lot of people.

As per usual, I'll give this a first-listen from the actual CD, then a second listen with the lyric booklet in hand.

justriiingo 2010.02.11 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lazer85 (Post 67453)
If I heard an old ringo song on a MIDI file without knowing it, I might be able to guess it was ringo from the melody and now I could not. Is that a bad thing or a good thing I dont know? It could mean shes too diverse now or it could mean shes lost something....probably a bit of both.

SR at 30 isn't anymore diverse than SR at 18.
Look at her early tracks and demos, she had samba (shampoo demo), bossa nova (aozora), punk rock (aozora gekokujyo live, identity), R&B (marusadi, in the same way early Utada tracks were R&B ), jazz (sakana), string quartet (yami ni furu ame), dance hall (yokushitsu), big band (mayonaka wa jyunketsu)....
And it all sounds uniquely Ringo.

Try listing that many influences from her work in the recent 5 years.

So my answer to your (rhetorical) question, She's lost it. (just about when adult was released.)

Denitson777 2010.02.11 06:58 PM

I like it so far,Yes it definitely sounds different,but that doesn't necessarily means is bad,And there is nothing generic to It,But I gonna wait until the album is released officially to listen to it again,This low quality rip really doesn't do any justice to this album.

Generic....yeah...whatever,This ain't generic at all.

kuro_neko 2010.02.11 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NIMH Rat (Post 67468)
Anything less than a 4-minute banshee wail from Ringo followed by a 3-minute atonal guitar riff that shrieks into oblivion will fall under the category of "generic" for a lot of people.

As per usual, I'll give this a first-listen from the actual CD, then a second listen with the lyric booklet in hand.

;;googely love eyes;;

justriingo, the demos sound passionate because they are unpolished and raw, which is what a lot of us like in ringo's voice. she hasn't lost it, it is just a matter of studio magic, how to capture the spontaneity and spark in the studio. adding more members to the mix (jihen) just complicates it, but I think the difference between us here at EMF is that some of us appreciate and enjoy what happens when ringo gets mixed together with other performers, and some of us just want solo old school ringo. the problem is that an artist with such an ecclectic and varied catalogue is bound to appease and disappoint any given number of us at any given time because she can't be everything at once. I'm personally just grateful she doesn't turn out the same shit over and over. if she was pumping out albums like SS or KZK year after year I'd get bored.

alleon86 2010.02.11 11:06 PM

tokjo jihen once again produce a very average album.

past 3 albums, variety, her solo(forgot the name), and this.

they all sucked. If ringo never made the albums before those 3, then it would be okay. But after she made those masterpeices, compare to those, these are pretty garbage.

ringo has always be able to write very memoriable melodies. for the past 2albums( variety doesnt count) she was unable to do so.

there are some okay songs in this album. but ringo made too many legendary songs. These are not good enough.

kuro_neko 2010.02.11 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alleon86 (Post 67473)
tokjo jihen once again produce a very average album.

past 3 albums, variety, her solo(forgot the name), and this.

they all sucked. If ringo never made the albums before those 3, then it would be okay. But after she made those masterpeices, compare to those, these are pretty garbage.

ringo has always be able to write very memoriable melodies. for the past 2albums( variety doesnt count) she was unable to do so.

there are some okay songs in this album. but ringo made too many legendary songs. These are not good enough.

you gotta remember, chances are ringo only wrote one or two songs on here (3min and maybe another song or two). the majority of this album is like variety, penned by the band members (ALLEGEDLY!!!)

lazer85 2010.02.11 11:51 PM

I'm really surprised none of the haters are comparing it to variety, to me they sound so similar except that I like this one (since it sounds more coherent). But you know, if you don't like it for other reasons, thats cool....not buying that its generic though, call it unoriginal if you want but generic sounds like you didnt listen to the whole thing.

For me, If an artist is trying to challenge themself and has an artistic vision, then its all a matter of how it sounds to my ears. I dont care if its original (though I usually prefer it) or similar to something else or difficult or easy. If there is anything generic about this though its that its so diverse that its sooo ridiculously generic ringo (honestly I'm quite tired of it, but thats not to say I don't like it sometimes).



Lets explore this though instead of just about the same thing;
I dont know why anyone wants anything NEW from ringo, shes done basically everything that wouldnt isolate her from the mainstream completely (ringo doing noise rock....hmmm? could be good but its not exactly easy to imagine her going THAT far) and I think shes jumped styles more than just about any musician out there who isnt trying to make a statement by doing so. She hasn't really deeply explored too many of the genres shes dabbled in though other than maybe heisei. I wish that if she were to do another non-TJ album, it would either be an as-solo-as-possible-for-what-she-wants-to-make (assuming she cant play EVERY instrument in her songs) album with everything composed and wirtten by her and musicians who have less of their own style and just do exactly what she wants them to do it OR it would be something like a soil and pimp collab.....ideally in japanese. I really think that would tie her to a certain style for an album and thats something I would really want to hear from ringo. Any genre would be fine as long as she gave it her best with songwriting and vocal melodies.

With MOST bands and musicians, I think demanding something new makes sense because most of them tend to stick to one or two genres or at least stick to one an album. I don't think applying this request to Ringo makes much sense because her #of styles explored to # of songs ratio is so ridiculous.

gekokujyo 2010.02.11 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justriiingo (Post 67469)
She's lost it. (just about when adult was released.)

UH... no. Not true.

kuro_neko 2010.02.12 12:17 AM

well Ringo has done borderline noise on zecchoshu and also Crawl on Kyouiku. I agree, there isn't a lot of ground Ringo *hasn't* covered, except straight up pop really. I mean she always kind of worked within the pop spectrum, but added little alternative aspects or ways to take it out of that realm. I'd be interested in hearing a 100% pop song from Ringo, like Ringo meets Ayu. I'm sure people are going to give me flack for that, but I don't really need Ringo to be some fallen rock icon, I like what she has done, and more importantly, I like what she does (as in, I like HF, SG, Adult, and I'll probably like this. I don't say Variety because it wasn't here, it was mostly Uki and Izawa).

since people are listening to leak and not paying attention to the main thread, I dug up some new sports-era photos from the kronekodow artist profile page and its up in the album news thread. kinda funny, take a look.

justriiingo 2010.02.12 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lazer85 (Post 67476)
I'm really surprised none of the haters are comparing it to variety...

Because "we the haters" don't remember, and don't want to remember what it sounds like.

Tsuki 2010.02.12 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuro_neko (Post 67472)
...she hasn't lost it, it is just a matter of studio magic, how to capture the spontaneity and spark in the studio. adding more members to the mix (jihen) just complicates it...

I haven't heard the album yet. However, if the debate over song quality is about a success (or failure) to capture the "studio magic," then how will they transition to a live performance? (This is, of course, assuming that spontaneity and spark is as easy to capture in the studio as it is to find in a concert.) If Dynamite Out was what really showed the full potential in Kyoiku (I think I'm paraphrasing Maou, but I might be thinking JR too), then maybe ULTRA C might do the same.

tldr; dude, if jihen did these songs live, would it be totally bitchin' or not?

Also, I'm interested in reading translations for FAIR and FOUL. I remember reading that Shiina did music for plays, so she might be slipping in Macbeth references.

kuro_neko 2010.02.12 10:47 AM

ooh macbeth? what makes you think that?

that is kind of what I meant. I think writing a song and creating a demo versus capturing that feel in a final studio recording is a challenging and difficult process. its akin to a writer successfully capturing an emotion through their pen or an artist inspiring some sort of emotion through their medium, its difficult to take what you've felt and transition that statically into a work, and then impart your intended message/feeling/emotion to the target audience. Tori Amos, for example, is really really picky about her demos. her husband, who also works as a sound engineer, wanted her to release some, but she said it almost ended in their divorce (LOL), but then later on her box set A Piano she released 3 demos of popular songs and wrote extensively about them, as an insight into studio magic. a lot her songs "come" to her, as in she gets inspiration, sits down, improvs, and just records. then later the trick is taking the demo into the studio, adding other instruments, and creating a full polished studio track. I think in Jihen's case less could be more. The problem with early Jihen (as I remember people criticizing Gunjou Biyori for this) is that it is almost overproduced, its like Ringo wanted to make sure there was a brilliant part for each member/instrument on every song, and it was almost too much. Songs like Onaji Yoru and Bonsai Hada and most of KZK are so refreshing because they selectively pair Ringo's voice with various non-traditional arrangements. Jihen tends to murder their studio compositions sometimes (Super Star, Toumei Ningen, almost all of Variety, when you compare it to Spa and Treatment or Society of the Citizens). That is just kind of what I meant.

Jesse 2010.02.12 09:36 PM

Ugh... I don't think I can hold off on downloading this for much longer. I just want to be sure my first listen is in decent quality...

mae 2010.02.13 12:58 PM

i just want to be sure I have a first listen

(said with humor, not complaining...)

Superficial Fan 2010.02.13 08:26 PM

I seriously wish she would stop singing in English. (Inspired by "Sweet Spot.")

I do actually like this more than Variety, I think, and considering that I like some tracks on Variety maybe that should be enough for me; but my expectations for this new album were high.

I will suspend ultimate judgment until my copy of the CD arrives (but that won't prevent me from posting negative comments based on this dubious rip).

Hmmm. Just listening to "Kimaru" for the first time and this might be my favorite track on the album so far.

I like "Ikiru" too. At times it seems like a funny blend of Queen and ELO. Not entirely.

On further listening: "Sweet Spot" is so bad it makes me wish I hadn't pre-ordered this album.

tsubame 2010.02.14 01:02 AM

This is definitely a good jump in the right direction, I'm enjoying this a lot more than Variety and Adult. It's not as rocky as I'd hoped though.

I shudder on hearing Sweet Spot though. I don't think that Ringo's voice is suited for the song's style...-_-

kuro_neko 2010.02.14 03:32 AM

I gave ikiru a listen. interesting stuff. haven't listened to the rest of the leak but based on what I have heard am pleasantly surprised at jihen's ongoing creativity and ability to tackle new things. 8+ original studio albums in the bag and ringo still manages to surprise with each album. :wub:

so_cold 2010.02.14 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lazer85
I'm really surprised none of the haters are comparing it to variety...
Quote:

Originally Posted by justriiingo (Post 67485)
Because "we the haters" don't remember, and don't want to remember what it sounds like.


Once bitten twice shy! Y'know I don't want to stay and be a "hater", because I'm not that. I didn't like this album at all, but I just want to be mellow. I'll just keep the demos, MM, SS, UM now; KZK once in a while; maybe the first two TJ songs I liked: Kurumaya-san and Tasogare Naki.

Tokyo Jihen will be the band on the Electric Mole video. I can play Kokoro and Sounan at the piano and it won't have poor production. The people in Japan who still sing MM and SS songs at karaoke and say they don't like her now are right. Tokyo Jihen made some excellent jazz-rock earlier on but they're making bad J-pop now, their name spells disappointment to me.

(Peace) -_-

bebio 2010.02.14 06:27 AM

I was writting a long post with my impressions. Alas, it got lost just as it was nearing completion.

Basically, I liked Sports, minor quibbles aside. No patience to write it all again...

hoopra 2010.02.14 04:33 PM

havent heard the leak yet, but yall setting my expections low now, i bet i will like it when i hear it, im just hoping for 4 good tracks and one really good one

madpawn 2010.02.14 06:37 PM

I find myself very moved by Zettai Zetsumei, for whatever reason.

This is a very good album. Doesn't have any killer tracks like "Killer Tune" and "OSCA," but it's a much stronger album overall than the last.

waki3691 2010.02.14 07:01 PM

IMO, I think that most of us are a bit disappointed because we have high hopes for this album and we were expecting killer tracks such as those from adult-era. But come on, if it was some unknown indie band who release SPORTS, we would probably think that it was a tremendous effort.

We just complaining because we think that TJ is great and we are just expecting more. Double standards...

lazer85 2010.02.14 11:25 PM

I was expecting absolute s hit so I'm pretty into it.

gekokujyo 2010.02.15 12:00 AM

Zettai zetsumei is freaking awesome. I have it as my ringtone now; just thought I'd say. Haha..

Regardless of whether the rumours are true, this really sounds like a Ringo/Izawa effort to me; the main hook/chorus sound extremely Izawa, and the 'verses' in between are really Ringo.

waki3691 2010.02.15 12:25 AM

Yea, it is awesome. The tune is so infectious. Lets forget the rumors and enjoy this song!

darkdisco 2010.02.15 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lazer85 (Post 67550)
I was expecting absolute s hit so I'm pretty into it.

Exactly. I try to go into any album release, Ringo or otherwise, with zero expectations. High expectations - for me, anyway - inevitably precede disappointment. I'm loving Sports, but then, over the past month or so, I've found myself getting more into Variety, so I don't expect anyone to take anything I have to say seriously. ;)

The only songs that aren't doing all that much for me right now are FAIR and FOUL. Zettai Zetsumei is my favorite so far, but I'm also really into Sweet Spot (I think her vocals are fine, and those backing vocals around two-and-a-half minutes in, the layered "close your eyes," gave me chills), Noriki, Utenkekkou, and Denpa Tsuushin.

obama917 2010.02.15 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gekokujyo (Post 67554)
Regardless of whether the rumours are true, this really sounds like a Ringo/Izawa effort to me; the main hook/chorus sound extremely Izawa, and the 'verses' in between are really Ringo.

You are right, Izawa has confirmed that he co-wrote zettai zatsumei with Ringo. I just read it in their interview for MUSICA magazine published today. Izawa presented his unfinished demo to the other members, and Ringo wanted to complete it. He soon received a demo finished by her, which he found really impressive. He thought, 'wow, co-writing is so easy. I didn't know that!'

He didn't specify who wrote which part, and I haven't listened to the track, but I am sure you are right. I am looking forward to giving it a first listen when the cd is released.

Tsuki 2010.02.15 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuro_neko (Post 67492)
ooh macbeth? what makes you think that?

("Fair is foul and foul is fair / Hover through fog and filthy air" is one off the more prominent lines from the Weird Sisters in Macbeth. Macbeth himself says "So foul and fair a day I have not seen," which I think is one of his first few lines. One way to interpret the lines is that something that seems good might be bad, and something that might be bad might ultimately be trying to help. It'd be interesting to see a Ringo take on this lyrically, so I'll be eagerly waiting for translations.

As for the criticism about song composition, it must be recognized that the relationship between a solo artist and the higher-ups is different from a relationship with a band and those same higher-ups. Shiina isn't being marketed. Jihen is, so every contribution has to be heard for people to associate the music with the members. This is especially important when a band first starts. But I digress.
)

And Iiii'm pretty excited to hear the sooongs, man. And the MUSICA interview sounds pretty awesome. It's cool to get some insight on co-writing. Any news on what else was brought up in the interview?

chibijelly 2010.02.15 11:50 AM

I really enjoyed this album. I've only listened to it maybe three times through, but... As a whole, it's better than Variety for me. The opening and ending tracks are very strong, and everything in-between seems to have been put together nicely. It's not TOO all over the place like Variety was. I like 9/13 tracks on this album, and I'm sure the rest of the songs might grow on me after a few more listens.

Random notes:
- Zettai Zetsumei is perfect. Absolutely perfect.
- I actually like Sweet Spot. I feel like the odd-person-out for saying that, but whatever. It's a nice song.
- Senkou Shoujo is still great.
- Kimaru is my favorite "epic" Jihen song since Tegami. There's something about it that is so whimsical.

freackled 2010.02.15 12:18 PM

The biggest disappointment for me is that this album doesn't have a... I guess badass song? Something equivalent to "Sake to Geko," which I find really moving. "Gaman" will have to suffice :(

Yahiko 2010.02.15 02:24 PM

I agree with whoever said Zettai Zetsumei is awesome :D

i'm loving this album

hoopra 2010.02.15 03:00 PM

sweet spot i like but will sound so much better live i guarantee, just like how karada is ten times better live in spa and treatment,

ShadyNook 2010.02.15 03:02 PM

I was alot quicker to warm up to the album than I expected. the only song i dont like is Megaphone Song 4.0.

for better or worse the fanbase is definitely going to grow and diversify because of the bands new style. Its good-time casual music but with an unmistakable TJ quirkiness.


the band sound alot more cohesive, i think its because there isnt as much instrumental peacocking like on previous albums. and Ringo's voice is the strongest i've ever heard from her. and yet i still think the band is still only getting acquainted with each other and the serious ambitious music wont come until they get into that zone that comes from a band being in constant contact with each other.

hearing about the Shiina/Izawa collabs is great to hear. Izawa is using 21st century synthesizer sounds, great to hear. Ukigumo's guitar sounds awesome which is even greater to hear! he discovered Big Muff Pi or something similar and uses it alot. His songs also add sophistication to the collection.

I like Sports more than Variety, but i havent figured out why that is as both albums are similar.

recreating the vocaloid effect for Ikiru will be something to see live.

Scribble R 2010.02.15 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopra (Post 67594)
karada is ten times better live in spa and treatment,

Seconded. I thought she would screw up Karada's vocals live but they pulled it off and made the song listenable. Even the 'Time to enjoy! No hesitation, just sweet sensation' (cringe) came off better live.

kuro_neko 2010.02.15 04:08 PM

holy crap positive reviews, finally :lol:

its pretty hard to not just open the leak (I have it on my HD...why, I have no idea). hopefully my order will ship soon, Variety arrived a full 4 days before japanese release day (I have no idea why it was sent so early), a boy can dream, right?

Tokyo Jihad 2010.02.15 07:50 PM

This was a very difficult album for me to get through. For one, I wasn’t particularly looking forward to it. Sanpukan really was rather boring. Not to mention this whole scene has a rather bad taste in my mouth thanks to some bright thinkers at this very forum. Sports sits at a very precarious situation. It is following Variety which was a weak album to say the least, and Sanmon Gossip from the SR solo side which featured some very good and interesting artistic takes and some very bad ones which unfortunately left the album with a “meh” appeal. Hey, why stop at Shiina? Since Variety, we’ve also been exposed to Izawa and Uki’s solo (or at least, non-Jihen related) efforts too. If one thing can be generalized, compared to post-Adult Jihen, the band seems to work better away from each other. Why then should we care if Tokyo Jihen releases another album? More importantly, do Shiina/Uki/Izawa/Kameda/Hata care about it more than it just being a sure paycheck? Artists gots to pay the bills, not like Appa is rolling in it… That was my big question/worry/dread going into this album: is this just payday for these guys pandering to the jpop-central or will they start putting some artistic attention into this band that they do their separate bands?

It took three tries to make it through this album for one reason though ultimately: it is a pretty rough start.

01. Ikiru: They tried something “new” with an acapella-ish song. They auto-tuned the guys, yet I have to assume they auto-out-of-tuned Shiina to counteract this. Must be a statement on that technology – or just Shiina singing poorly. But we’d never expect that from her, right? Then the song inexplicably rehashes Killer Tune’s outro. Coming back around to this song, you see they are trying to set up their real jewel later in the album, which is a noble attempt but I just don’t think we are primed well enough to accept Ikiru due to the ending and the next three songs which move the listener far away from this focus.

02. Denpa Tsuuchin: Once you cede there aren’t going to be anymore Honnous, Ichijikus, or even Gunjous, I think you can live with a song like this. It actually has a hook, catchy chorus. Once you get passed Kameda, I think this a very adequate song and should be a single. They kind of drop the ball on the ending, but, well. The band has a fascination with these hyper-pop songs and I guess they’re just not going away (that and the lounge stuff.) Finally we got a good one. Electronic keys by Izawa and the production on Shiina’s vocals definitely solidify this song.

03. Season Sayonara: An all round sloppily written song to play during the credits of an anime. Vapid, insists on being fast and rapid so it can hurry up and go nowhere. This is the tails side of the hyper-pop coin. Part of me wonders if slowing this down would help settle things.

04. Kachi-ikusa: The problem with Jihen is that too often their songs are flat. If the song were a landscape there would be no peaks or valleys, just one constant plateau. Seemingly the only way they counteract this is that they just make the outro really fast bafflingly. That’s a cop out and this is a perfect example of a song where they don’t even do that.

05. FOUL: Izawa’s solo is pretty good here, in fact the band is playing uncharacteristically inoffensive – except Shiina, but I think that’s less to do with the distorted vocals and more to do with the melody that could have been sharpened. Surprisingly, not bad enough to use the license to go all out with unfunny puns using the songs name. Not exactly a single but it’s a fun Jihen-brand freak out song (which is what Osca was I guess, but I didn’t and still just don’t get that song.)

06. Utenkekkou: The intro leads you to believe the worst – Kameda’s dreadfully omnipresent bass and harmony from Uki. However, the skies clear and there is a very pretty song in there. There are parts that completely work for this song. Izawa’s outro, the end of the musical bridge and they make you forget about some of the lackluster parts of the song: the beginning of the bridge and the lack of a chorus for the most part.

07. Noudouteki Sanpukan: So this is the single I listened to twice and forgot about completely. The song opens so promising with something that’s NOT Ukitar, piano, bass, or Shiina screeching; such a welcome change you’re almost willing to give anything that’s coming a pass. However, I keep waiting for the song to start. This song seems a lot like Shun from SG, it’s not annoying enough to make a mad dash for the skip button, but I really don’t think it’s a song that has the kind of appeal to make you dig out the cd and give it a spin. I will say this is a typical post-Adult TJ song where it just seems to go on and on so rather than building upon itself (like Honnou.) Frankly, I think these kind of songs are what hurt the band and make their songs pretty unremarkable.

08. Zettai Zetsumei: The good here is that Shiina is singing from a different register than she has sung in a long while (well, if O Chiten Kara counts as a long time.) People seem to like this song, its bright its poppy, and at this point in the album I’m willing to give the band credit they’ve outgrown their “selfish” performances. However, I just can’t ultimately give this song a big thumbs up and the problems are structural. From the moment the song starts til 1:13, we hear the hook/chrorus of the song for two iterations and it’s pretty good. But from that moment we go into a sequence of verse-counter chrorus-guitar solo-verse and only then until 2:40 (of a 3:07 song) do we go back to the chorus a final time. I think in that 1:30 gap – half the song, we are taken so far away from what should be the heart of the song that when we do go back to it we’re thinking “finally.” The fact there’s a solo after the counter of the hook really impedes the momentum of the song. It doesn’t ruin the song, if I’m not paying attention I don’t mind so much – but that’s not a good qualifier. It’s a good song, not a great song.

09. FAIR: The word that most describes the album up to this point. This song might as well have begun at 2:01 because Shiina’s part really doesn’t add a thing to the song up to that point and the musical bridge is pretty darn solid. The outro fairs better.

10. Noriki: It sounds like Denpa’s less talented little brother, however I don’t want to say there’s no charm here. It does fall prey to some weak writing in parts, but I think the better parts do pull the song up. The chorus is another one of those Kingyo/Season Sayonara choruses that sounds like it’s really in a hurry to go nowhere, but this time it actually does have a nice payoff (even if we have to wait for the second time around.) The break down at 2:13 is really effective, however then falls prey to TJ’s fast-outro fascination.

11. Sweet Spot: I’m trying my best to ignore the lyrics, and choose to assume the rest of the lyrics are not this awkward. I think this is a surprisingly good song. I am a fan of Shiina + acoustic guitar. I got really hopeful at 2:00 that the build-up was really going to knock this song out of the park, unfortunately it climaxed with a same old Uki solo coming from the same guitar we’ve heard most of the album rather than going for something with more contrast – like this song. Oh well, beyond that the outro thankfully does not ruin a song that I rather like.

12. Senkou Shoujo: I swear to god, if this song was included for the god damned symmetry… I like this song, one of my favorite VARIETY-ERA songs. That said, it does not belong here at all. Doesn’t even fit thematically, unless “made by Tokyo Jihen” is a theme. Going from Sweet Spot to the intro of Kimaru sounds GREAT. SS here was a horrible decision. This does not work like Death Jazz worked on SG.

13. Kimaru: Sonically, it’s the most interesting thing Shiina has done since Ichijiku no Hana or any other KZK song. I get hints of Revolver here (Love You To, Tomorrow Never Knows.) That’s right I am actually favorably comparing a Jihen song to The Beatles. Believe me, no one is happier or more surprised than me about that. I wonder how different this would have sounded had they gotten a small quartet for the harmony rather than the auto-tuned Uki-Shiinas, but hey, the band is finally taking a big step in the right direction FINALLY, let’s not get ahead of ourselves. This is the one of the few out and out experimental things since Virgin Line’s Souretsu and Gunjo and I couldn’t be happier to hear it.

As the album progresses, it sounds like band becomes more and more interested in playing as a band, trying new things, and most importantly, performing songs (rather than parts which was a big knock on Variety.) Progress isn’t pretty, and this album isn’t pretty even in its struggle. The listener has to struggle with the songs at times. The album opens with a song that is alluding to the closer but I’m not sure has an identity of its own. Denpa is a really good song, but contrasts so much with Ikiru. The next two songs are so aimless the album really falls off the . I think with Foul and onwards the album does find a center but even then I’m left to ponder if some of the songs don’t sound quite similar, like maybe there are really only 5 or 6 songs here. Senkou Shoujo is outright puzzling. Then I wonder if Sweet Spot and Kimaru clouding my judgment on the rest of the album. If Sweet Spot was Karada and Kimaru was just Ikiru would I look less kindly on some of the shortcomings on some real “almost there” songs like Noriki and Utenkekkou. You know, I would have been happy with Ikiru if the band kept it up and just ended before the instruments or at least kept it operatic all the way through. Of course, I wish there was more experimental stuff, but I am happy that there was some at all and got a really great track or two out of it and really put a pleasing coating on the album as a whole.

The frustrating thing with Jihen is that Sports really sounds like a band still coming together. 10 years ago Shiina and Kameda were already making much stronger music all around. It’s tough as a fan to move backwards like that, like watching your favorite all star athlete get injured and practically have to relearn their sport. That’s how I feel listening to new TJ stuff. Whatever the reason, Sports is improvement. Better than JCHI, better than Variety, maybe even better than SG and Rashipoki. I don’t know if Sports as an entire album will reside in my mp3 player or just cherry-pick the songs (which Variety, as it officially stands, does not.) Part of me says yes, Jihen seems to be doing the right thing again, but then again am I ever really going to listen to Sanpukan or Kachi-ikusa? Improvement though means just maybe they do care.

6/10

3 picks: Kimaru, Denpa Tsuuchin, Sweet Spot.

Really, just skip Senkou Shoujo.

Superficial Fan 2010.02.15 08:30 PM

Thoughtful discussion of the new album. This is a good overall point (with a brutally apt metaphor):

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tokyo Jihad (Post 67604)
The frustrating thing with Jihen is that Sports really sounds like a band still coming together. 10 years ago Shiina and Kameda were already making much stronger music all around. It’s tough as a fan to move backwards like that, like watching your favorite all star athlete get injured and practically have to relearn their sport. That’s how I feel listening to new TJ stuff.

There may be more to like about "Sweet Spot" than I am giving it credit for, but I can't get past SR's English vocals on this one.

justriiingo 2010.02.16 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadyNook (Post 67595)
recreating the vocaloid effect for Ikiru will be something to see live.

don't be disappointed if all you get is 2 mics and a box with some knobs.
or worse, they're not even gonna do the vocals live. They might just do a "reverse karaoke" and play that vocal track like a sample.

On a different note.
Is it acceptable for Tokyo Jihen to be "still coming together"? It's been ... 3 albums. And it's a band of industry professionals not 14 yr olds playing with Ableton Live. Tokyo Jihen was started in 2004 by SR as a "revolution", to change the sound of popular music. Now they sound exactly like the thing they were going to change. 2 legs good?

zyoeru 2010.02.16 03:14 AM

I actually like this album, it's a lot better than Variety, but I also liked Variety too, so I'm not too much of a discerning critic.

lazer85 2010.02.16 05:35 AM

wow jihad, for the most part I really have no interest in reading everyones in-depth thoughts and would much prefer highlights but I read through like 90% of that and do not regret it. I understand where your coming from completely on almost every point. I'm trying to a be a little bit more positive until I get the physical album and hear it in better quality but I think in 3 months your review will sum up my opinion give or take 2 songs. GOOD CALL on Senkou shojo, its a really good song but it doesnt really belong here. Still better than variety where nothing belonged together.

obama917 2010.02.16 06:12 AM

MUSICA published two separate interviews; one with Ringo only and the other with the other four members. I think this tactic worked well because it helped Ringo say what she would have hesitated to say if the other members were present, and the same for the four guys.

Below is a summary of the Ringo part:

- To Ringo, Sports is what she has always dreamed to produce. She thought she could make it earlier (seemingly early 2009) but chose to do SG first. The main reason for doing SG was that she wanted to release songs that she had written but not recorded for reasons like not fitting for TJ.

- She felt that solo recording for SG was much easier than with TJ because she could control everything and make decisions on her own. Also, she very much enjoyed collaborating with her favorite non-TJ musicians. She was a bit concerned if she would get as excited when returning to TJ.

- While she wanted relaxed atmosphere from Variety, she wanted Sports to bring a sense of tension, though she didn't tell it to the other members in words. When they had several options during the Sports recording, she always insisted on choosing one that they hadn't done before.

- They tried more than twice as many songs as those actually included in the album. That was unusual for Ringo, who rarely drops songs in recording. But she says they dropped quite a few songs just because they wouldn't fit in this album, and such songs will be saved for the next release.

- In the past, she always reacted to the music scene by offering something lacking in the scene at that time. This time, however, she purely followed her artistic instinct and pursued what brings musical pleasure to her. For her, SG was meant to set the standard for pops which she thought the music scene needed, while she created Sports as an antithese to the standard, or a more avant-garde thing.

- Noudouteki is a song where the groove is everything. But it was very difficult for all the members to share the same groove. At one point, she said to the other members that if TJ couldn't create the groove required for this track, they had to drop it. As this track was chosen for the Kiss-mint CM and thus could not be dropped, she nearly said she would record it using a synth alone. When the song hit number one in Oricon charts, she was delighted because she thought it was far from a catchy song but nevertheless people liked it.

- When they did the a capella part for Ikiru, she wasn't really sure where they were heading for. But she pretended to be confident, trying not to make the other members anxious.

- She wrote all lyrics after music, carefully choosing words that fit into music. The writing process was very stressful for her because she felt as if living in the music, isolated from the outer world. Also, making lyrics dependent on music was against the convention of J-pop where lyrics pleasing to the ear matter more than music itself.

- She had no fun when recording vocals for this album. After the other members finished their instrumental parts, she was left alone in the studio for a long time and nearly went mad. She remembers this particular period (late 2009) as the toughest time in her life, and she never wants to go through it again. She even says that she is so exhausted after the recording that she doesn't care if Sports turns out her last album, half-jokingly.

lazer85 2010.02.16 07:03 AM

Ok well I'm glad the vocals came hard for her, it makes the lyrics on track 4 just a little easier to accept

Scribble R 2010.02.16 07:03 AM

Thank you, obama. Many assumptions get thrown around, and non-JP fans don't often get info straight from Ringo's mouth (In proportion to the amount of interviews she's done) so it's great to read this stuff.

D.K.Liu 2010.02.16 07:07 AM

To justriiingo: 'coming together as a band' and being 'professional' are very different things. Regardless of how you rate their output on Adult and Variety (I haven't heard Sports), I think it's hard to fault them on professionalism. I also don't recall reading about SR's ambition for TJ... I'd be grateful if you can point me in the right direction

To obama917: thanks for the summary. It's kind of ironic that... the process of creating music that brings SR musical pleasure causes her so much pain.

kuro_neko 2010.02.16 09:52 AM

obama, thanks for the article summary! was the jihen interview in the same issue? I like how Ringo herself refers to the fact that the process of the album itself goes against the idea of jpop, once and for all settling whether or not jihen has bit the big one and started making "generic jpop."

dr. k.liu when ringo created jihen she did an interview about why she created the band, she also brought it up again during her 10th year anniversary massive interview in Rockin'On. I don't recall her ever saying anything about creating a music revolution, but I do remember her saying she had always wanted to be in a band (that is where she started), and it was time she worked back towards a band formation, now that she had done what she had set out to do as "Shiina Ringo," she could forget about that persona and just relax, create music as she wanted, with a band, and be herself. She kept the name, but I think that is a large reason why you can immediately point out a difference between SR solo and post TJ formation. Even SG isn't true "Shiina Ringo" in the sense that SR was a concept, a specific idea and persona created, reflected in the music, whereas SG seems to be a collection of music by Ringo not fitting TJ. Once Ringo stopped and created TJ, it was less about that and more about her actual self, and the type of things and music she as a person wanted to create. After all, I do think there was a reason why she picked the musicians she did for the band, and not entirely new members. Up to that point she had worked with them and was comfortable with them, so she could relax and just let allow herself to create. So TJ as a whole feels like a very organic and natural progression and idea to me, at first it was about letting Ringo let her hair down and just allowing herself to create, to do whatever, and now that the band has shifted and grown, its more about a group effort and finding the middle between all 5 of them, which shifts each record. I'm glad for this one that it has taken a more avant garde direction.

Orenji 2010.02.16 11:14 AM

Thanks for posting the review highlights, it was very interesting to read! I'm in love with this album, I'm serious T_T...

ShadyNook 2010.02.16 01:05 PM

i'm impressed how Ringo's concerns directly address what many people on this forum have mentioned. Her desire to screw the band and do a song with just her and a synth is funny.

she doesnt even think Noudoteki is very catchy. that sounds familiar. its like she's one of us.

Scribble R 2010.02.16 01:22 PM

If anyone thinks Sports is generic J-Pop, just wait for the album that Ringo is saving 'Marvelous Days' for. Kawaii desu ne ^.^;;;;

Orenji 2010.02.16 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scribble R (Post 67631)
If anyone thinks Sports is generic J-Pop, just wait for the album that Ringo is saving 'Marvelous Days' for. Kawaii desu ne ^.^;;;;

Hey, Marvelous Days is one of my favorite demos of hers ;_;!!

Entry№1 2010.02.16 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scribble R (Post 67631)
If anyone thinks Sports is generic J-Pop, just wait for the album that Ringo is saving 'Marvelous Days' for. Kawaii desu ne ^.^;;;;

Don't take the name of "Marvelous Days" in vain, nonbeliever!










:ph43r:


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