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Old 2007.07.24, 08:22 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Tokyo Jihad View Post
Steph just jas a habit of saying what I'm thinking, only much more eloquently and i'm not "telling you off" I'm just saying....wrong.=p

And Hirama makes the song. Judging from Superstar from Dynamite, "plucky-plucky" has no place in the song. This songs about EMOTION, raw, powerful emotion. Hirama added some body, some "fuckin Superstar" to Superstar. JCHI's ver sounds more like a snazzed up gospel song for lack of better phrasing. Uki's guitar always fails to deliver emotion (amongst other things.) I've used the analogy before, but in Dynamite it sounds like the guitars wailing. In JCHI, it sounds like someones trying to make their guitar wail. And I don't see what "uki solo" youre talking about. Its nonexistant unless youre talking about him playing the same 4 notes in the middle-break, before failing to copy Hirama's lead back in to the chorus.

In Dynamite they sound like Superstars. In JCHI, they sound like they're just playing a song.

EDIT: and Shiina is playing power chords in Dynamite's rendition
and why is it chic to rag on power chords. They're the only chords with the word "power" in their name and can be necessary. |(

Well Jihad, this is one of those rare occasions where I wonder if you listened to the song. Now, while that's not a personal attack, I really can't see where that assessment comes from. I hear the emotion in DO Superstar, but I also hear it in JCHI's. You can even see the emotion on Uki's face in this song (along with everyone else), which you don't really get a lot in this concert.


PS - JCHI Superstar has that neat outro guitar part, which is definitely a bonus.
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Old 2007.07.24, 08:33 PM   #42
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Actually, let me fix that before I do anything else. I didn't quite mean that I don't think you listened to the song, or that you've suddenly allowed your analysis of a song to be influenced by other factors, but I am confused as to how you came about feeling this way about it.

I figure most of the difference in the "feeling" of the two songs is based on the way they're written, because I definitely see the emotion in each..
Dynamite Out's Superstar sounds a lot like a new piece of work that hasn't yet been finely tuned, so much of the emotion is based on the band getting a feel for the song (if that makes sense), while it seems to me that JCHI's version is more developed, so any less emotional sound may be based on the fact that the performers already know the song more personally than before, though you can definitely tell they're really getting into what they're playing.
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Old 2007.07.24, 08:36 PM   #43
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Really. In fact I did re-visit JCHI's performance just before my post. The guitar just sounds "there." It has none of the force and charge of DO's take. Maybe towards the end Uki is hitting more notes than Hirama, but I don't feel its at all nearly as effective. As much as Izawa is banging his head, its not nearly as head-bang worthy as the DO rendition, it had more body more charge -- It was not piano-driven (which Ithink cued me to say it was more "gospel-sounding" above.) Everything about it is not nearly as lively as DO, and the guitar (and lacking 1 we had before) is something to note.
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Old 2007.07.25, 02:56 PM   #44
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This is one of those arguments no ones really gonna win I'm not saying power chord is uncool, just when its the "powerchord, scratch, scratch, powerchord" variety, its a little too...generic for a TJ song don't you think? Compare to other songs played on DO, superstar is just undercooked, and lacking that SR trademark texture and complexity. And lets be fair here, Your dislike of JCHI's superstar is part of your Uki hating bias, while I criticize DO's superstar and still consider DO to be THE DEFINITIVE performance of TJ.
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Old 2007.07.25, 03:06 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Kasanagi View Post
...just when its the "powerchord, scratch, scratch, powerchord" variety, its a little too...generic for a TJ song don't you think?
no.

:p

Compare to other songs played on DO, superstar is just undercooked, and lacking that SR trademark texture and complexity. And lets be fair here, Your dislike of JCHI's superstar is part of your Uki hating bias, while I criticize DO's superstar and still consider DO to be THE DEFINITIVE performance of TJ.
Addressing the last part first, considering Uki is essentially buried through 60% of the song at least, its not all Uki.
I don't see whats with all this "complexity" talk this week. It's music, not a cross-word puzzle. Sometimes its not necessary to be tricky every bar. DO's Superstar was raw and powerful and that leands to the fact that it was played more simply.

See it this way, if you wanna motivate people in a speech, what do you do? Do you eloquently and proliferously explicate en masse quantities of verbiage? Or do you boil your message down into simple phrases and revisit them to hammer the message in?
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Old 2007.07.25, 03:26 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Tokyo Jihad View Post
no.

See it this way, if you wanna motivate people in a speech, what do you do? Do you eloquently and proliferously explicate en masse quantities of verbiage? Or do you boil your message down into simple phrases and revisit them to hammer the message in?
I dunno how you manage to make the connection between motivational speeches and Superstar , but yea, simple phrases like "THIS, IS, SPARTA!!!!" or "You can take our lives, but j00 can't take away, our FREEDOM!!" really hammer the message in

ANYWAY, I'd say we again establish the fact that we're all agruing based on our opinions, and as long as you elobrate on your opinion, instead of getting Stephy to do YOUR dirty work and tell me I'm wrong without explaining that its from your opinion and not some absolute, gospel truth, I'll settle. Just making sure the minds of any new and navie TJ/SR fans will not make up their minds about JCHI from a simple "WRONG"

And tonight, we shall dine in HELLLLLLL!!!!!!
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Old 2007.07.25, 03:41 PM   #47
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Well, music motivates people just as a speech does. It can motivate people to dance, have a good time, "get biz-zay," anarchy in the UK, whatever.

And I like to think if I post a pic like that, I like to think of it as a book cover. It asks you "do you really want to open this one up and see whats to be said?" =P
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Old 2007.07.25, 04:44 PM   #48
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I showed this DVD to a friend of mine who didn't know much about Shiina Ringo or Tokyo Jihen before. He told me that it looked like Shiina has much more potential, but that something was holding her back... and that they all looked so bored. I just thought that hit the nail on the head.
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Old 2007.07.25, 09:50 PM   #49
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Freackled is back!

I still think Just Can't Help It was laid-back because of the "adult" theme, whether they completely carried that idea through the whole concert or not (and whether or not the fans appreciated it). That doesn't suggest that Uki would necessarily be more lively in another type of concert, because he seems to be really focused on what he's playing rather than going out of his way to impress people.. however, the two videos from Countdown Japan 06/07 show him displaying a bit more energy.

Anyway, the whole band (save Hata) seems to be displaying the withdrawn type of attitude in JCHI, which I personally enjoy for the type of music they're playing.
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Old 2007.07.26, 04:52 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by fluffiethesock View Post
Freackled is back!

I still think Just Can't Help It was laid-back because of the "adult" theme, whether they completely carried that idea through the whole concert or not (and whether or not the fans appreciated it). That doesn't suggest that Uki would necessarily be more lively in another type of concert, because he seems to be really focused on what he's playing rather than going out of his way to impress people.. however, the two videos from Countdown Japan 06/07 show him displaying a bit more energy.
Yes, I agree. This is another reason why comparing uki's playing of old TJ songs with similar arrangements to the ones Hirama played in DO is not accurate in saying who is better or anything like that. The reason is because I believe that since they are playing a more laid back style, even the old songs with similar arrangements were played with a more relaxed style in JCHI. For example, I thought that Izawa's playing was not as powerful as HZM's in Jusui Negai but I wouldn't say it's because Izawa can't play the same way as HZM because the song just sounds more laid back in general.

And just going on uki v. hirama, I think it's just some people don't like that TJ is not just a rock band as they were in phase 1. And by JUST I don't mean that they suck or anything but only that they were more rock-oriented.
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