[Electric Hate Forum] The Apple, rotted from stem to core
 

This is the thread for the line of discussion that ensued in the KT thread before it was poo-pooed, even tho it seems to be worth discussing. If a mod would s kindly move the posts from there to here, it'd be greatly appreciated.

In case you missed it, turn to page 9 in your Killer Tune thread.

Cliff notes ver: Op2 inadvertently cues me to explicate why I think Shiina was/is full of shit, and then Hedo comes along to "not get" it.

However, I think I said my peace to all aspects, so you can discuss these bold statements if you wish.
(To Hedo: As I've told you before, you completely forget theres more to music than whats physically and audibly there. That's al I'm gonna say. Meditate on that some, please ;))

Disclaimer: For those of you who are just joining us because you enjoy the work of Shiina Ringo and Tokyo Jihen and were excited to find a forum where you can discuss their music, these negative views are only carried by a select few (to the best of my knowledge -- admittedly I could be wrong). Others may be discouraged by specific pieces of music, but have not lost their faith in Shiina Ringo as a writer, singer, or performer.
Still, others do enjoy all of Shiina Ringo and Tokyo Jihen's latest releases, and (at the risk of being called a mindless fan[boy/girl]), should not feel inhibited from voicing their opinions as well.

While many signs may point to it, you have not wandered into a completely disgruntled community.


[Note: Do not confuse this post as me saying that we would be better off without this thread. It is understandable that people are upset with the changes, and I believe that they should be encouraged to discuss it.]

:rolleyes:
Theres closer to 99 other threads started with positive intentions on this board alone. If were a "select few" is because many older fans jumped ship.

The apple is not plastic. If it was, then it would still be the same like 8 years ago XD
That would be cool

so I wish that the apple was plastic >_<
I hope that next year maybe (or the next, or the next next) the apple will ressurect and give us again her acid taste that she gave when she was lively

There was nothing happening in page 9 @_@.

I didn't miss the point, I replied to everything you said pretty accurately so maybe you should explain what I missed?

Anyway, of course there is more to music than just what you hear because it can make people feel unexplainable things which are really hard to point out. Since everyone has a different interpretation of the same song, it's best to try to judge what IS there and not what you think is there, or should/should not be there. If you feel bad about OSCA and Killer Tune, thats all good but you need to separate how you feel about the new releases and what you think about the old ones. Claiming that Ringo was a fake or is a fake is just your speculation but that does not give you the right to now say that her old work was sucks now because you think she is a fake. Like I said in the killer tune thread, how can you fake out her early works? They were genius (I also like their newer works alot as well but you only like/liked the old ones). How can you now turn and say that her old works were nothing because she is faking now? You can't say she was "faking" then because those works were no flukes (as you yourself said). So what are you saying? You don't think her old works are good because she is "faking" right now? That does not make sense to me.

EDIT: All I'm asking is to judge the albums by what they are, and not by how you feel about Ringo's works now. It's not good to judge based on rage/passion. You can't say that you didn't mean what you said about ADULT before, but only that you can't enjoy it anymore because in YOUR eyes, Ringo has been tarnished.

EDIT #2: " And by backbone i mean 'cohesiveness.'" Since when is that? I feel that you are just flipping words around and I'm just saying the same thing so I really do not care to keep arguing this since it's you that is missing out on all her works and not me.

I think Shiina is more interested in pleasing a mass audience these days than digging into herself. She hasn't made an *anthem* for rebellious youth in the vein of Honnou for years now. I'm not an expert on Japanese society, but the multitudinous social problems of today's Japan are pretty well documented, and SS-era Shiina seems to speak for a lot of Japanese youth (I must have heard Honnou 4-5 times browsing in clothing stores in Tokyo just a year and a half ago).

That's just one form of her authenticity: speaking for herself, and by extension for a lot of her fans.

The other is her pure musical skill, and that's what evolved in KSK, was adapted into Tokyo Jihen, and is now kicking ass. It doesn't really "speak for" an audience, in the rebellious sense. It's more about pleasure and distraction. Dynamite Out was sort-of cathartic in that it had this incredible energy, you can't help but have a physical response to it. But it didn't pierce, it didn't haunt, it didn't *move* the way solo Shiina moved.

If not for the Ringohan concerts, and her work with Saito Neko, I'd suspect she simply calculated her younger persona, and let herself be exploited by faddish marketers until she was successful enough to do what she really wanted to do.

But I believe her when she says she merely changed. She is older now, with a child. She is successful. What does she have to be angry about? What are her passions? I think her passion now is to please a mass audience, with music that may not be as challenging and in-your-face as her previous music, but with the same standards of high quality we've come to expect.

She wants to please us because she's pleased with her own life.

To me, that's integrity.

Life is good for her now, the music is saying. But life, as we all know, kicks your ass every once in a while. It goes up and down. I hope it never goes down for anyone, but of course it does; I just hope that when it happens to artists I love, like Shiina, that they put it in their art. That they don't give up. We need art more than ever when life sucks.

Is she relevant to today's social problems? Well, she's not singing about war, or the decline of the family, or the bad economy, or corrupted values. In that sense, she is irrelevant, more "of" the system than "against" the system.

But if she's honestly not enraged about things, or rebellious, and the other members of Tokyo Jihen feel the same way, then their music does have purpose. They are expressing their enjoyment of the life they have.

That doesn't usually win awards. It doesn't make them "edgy" or "hard." As Douglas Adams said about our planet Earth, they are "mostly harmless." And fun. And brilliant.

They just aren't pissed off about anything. That's not the same as being without passion. Their passion is to entertain us, and on that level they score big time.

(response to Hedo)
They were fake if they were not true extensions of Shiina. If they were written because "this is my ticket."

See it this way, I can write a rap song. Maybe even a really good one. Let's just say, and I played up the image. And people really liked it, they bought my blinged records, wore their do-rags like I wore em, and as is apparent on these forums, I have the street-cred.
The problem being? Thats not me. Rap can be fun and the like, but I'm not a "rap" kinda guy -- but I was "frontin" that I was. How irate would the people that saw me as the second coming of BIG be if I was just doing it cuz I could and not because it was what I really was? If I put out an acoustic rock record and played it that I was "stretching my art" and disowning my earlier rap songs -- what credibility do I have? I duped a bunch of people into thinking I was something I wasn't.

Sure, you can piddle with genres and swap them, but you don't swap your philosophy.

This is beyond "HF an Variety are (likely) shit" this is Shiina wrote rock songs cuz she could, played it up, made us believe, but wasn't truly what she was. Whether "phase 2" is 'her' any more than the early stuff was doesn't matter because she already compromised that artistic trust. Why should we think a few years from now she won't separate herself from these albums too?

I'm with you all the way, NIHM. I don't see why Ringo is a fake or anything because the band's style has changed. I know I keep saying this, but I'll say it again: Its not bad music, it just depends whether it is your kind of STYLE of music or not. I've heard a lot of music that I can't stand but you can always tell if it is good or not even if you don't like it.

IF she separates herself from these albums, then so be it. It doesn't make her any less of an artist for it. You do what you are happy with, some people will burn you for it and other will praise you but it doesn't make you any less of a person. Just because she is a public figure doesn't mean she can't live her life as well. And as different as Uki and Izawa's songs are from Ringo's old works, they still have a sense of quality that most other artists who do similar works as their MAIN thing cannot even reproduce.

I would be so far from irate, Jihad, you have no idea. In fact, I'd be MORE impressed if I found out, say, that a white woman wrote 50 Cents' P.I.M.P., and not Fitty His-self.

Not to get all lit-crit, but John Keats' theory of "negative capability" has a lot of value. He judged a work of art not by how close it was to the artist's experience but by how *far away* it was. In his eyes, Shakespeare was the greatest author of all time because Shakespeare, even though he never spent one minute in the shoes of most of his characters, nevertheless wrote them, and did a damn fine job doing it. That, to Keats, is what the imagination is all about, and "imagination" should be valued over simple self-expression.

I think there's a lot to that. At the same time, there's genius. The same Mozart that wrote the mazurkas wrote the requiem. You can't study that, or learn it. That's simply God's gift. (I'm an atheist, but bear with me.)

I'm not saying Shiina is a genius on that level. But I do think she's proven to be a good chameleon, channelling personas that may not be remotely close to her own.

Which one is the "authentic" one? That's an impossible question. Her Honnou persona could very well be the authentic one, *at the time she wrote it*. Just like her crowd-pleasing TJ persona could be authentic *for the time being*. I don't think a person should be expected to declare one particular "authentic" persona early in their career and never move away from it. That's pretty restrictive, and unrealistic.

is a "persona channeling chameleon" just a nice way to say "big fakey"?

Just to me, anyway.

And if the Beatles could do it with just about every song on the white album, why isn't she allowed? ;)

John disowned the Beatles.. does that count? :(

No, I can't. Seriously, I can't imagine that anybody would like Metal or songs by Uki. I just can't. But there are people, and they like it. So either way I am right, and anybody who listens to Metal and Ukisongs is stupid, or I can't tell what's a good song without liking it.

The key question is, how do you know SR's true self? If you can write an awesome rap album, more power to you. "Faking" would be Britney Spears acting innocent and singing about true love and shit; If you are capable of writing your own music, regardless of style or genre, then that music IS you. You are not writing an essay about your life, you are making art, and art requires imagination and a bit of irrational thinking.:hmph:

It doesn't matter what her true is, shes already put up one facade too many.

...So it doesn't matter who SR is, was and ever will be, as long as you don't like her, she's faking it? (And yes, I AM twisting your words muhahahaha)

I'm believing in '99 she said "this is me, this is who i am" and it wasn't. It was an act. Or if not, that was truly her and now, that she's trying to bury that past, is the act (or they're both acts, who cares.) Either way, that's no kind of person I keep in good graces.

No expression of true self? One facade too many?

Sounds like you just came back from a business trip to Japan.

:)

Any whine about people being fake really takes me back to middle school when people are so strung up on that concept. Can you define being real? People have many different faucets of reality within themselves even. Personality and the self are both a very complex mesh that NOBODY else can define.

Take the Britney Spears example someone gave. She sung about true love and had a innocent image, but did a lot of things that were in fact "slutty". However, why can't people have both qualities? It's not unlikely that a person who sleeps around a lot can also yearn for "the one".

Personality is not concrete people. It changes with time, circumstance, environment, etc.

Shiina is not excluded. She became a mother, she grew older. She formed a band. She waited. Her personality at the time WAS about being different. And being bitchy, ecclectic, yadda yadda IS being different. I never thought that she was really the image she portrayed; I more thought she was pursuing her identity more as an art... it does not have to reveal oneself necessarily, but one's perception of other selves. Shiina was portraying what she thought of a bitchy, ecclectic person. That's a type of art.

People will always be cynical and thinkn it's only for the money or whatever. But even if we go with that thinking, what happens if it's both for the publicity, the mass appeal, the attention, AND to appeal to one's own sense of art? They don't have to be mutually exclusive.

This is the mature, 3-dimensional perspective. Don't be stuck with high school thinking. :\

Agreed 100%.
From the video below: People that think looks don't matter and personality is the "truth" need to rethink that. Personality is merely presentation. I can be sweet, I can be angry, I can pretend to like you, but secretly hate you. I can act like I care and make you believe it, but couldn't care less. You can judge my personality but you could be wrong. No one knows except me; Shiina is the same. Therefore, personality does not equal what is "real".

I advise everyone to watch all of this:

Fuck personality.

^ That someone uses the Britney Spears examples becauses the whole "innocent, im a virgin" thing was a carefully marketed image backed by mutli million dollar businesses, completely ruined by her not so careful private life...

I do agree with you on everything else though :)

For the love of god dude, I've been a lurker here for a long, long time, and now I'm like..actually posting because you make me climb the walls. Yes, no matter how hard it is for you to accept this, there are people that ENJOY what Yumiko is doing. I'm all for opinions, when you get down the real thing at hand, I could care less if you don't like her recent stuff. You just act like a little kid who thinks his opinion is the best and makes a thread to act all crazy about it. It's not your style, its not your taste, whatever. Move on, obviously you don't enjoy her/TJ's new stuff anymore. I like all of HF, yes, I love it all. I dance like a nerd to Papaya Mango [not really, but you get the point.] You strike me also as one of those holier than thou hardcore music people who is concerned with every little thing about a song, even to the point where you criticize Uki's guitar playing. I've never even touched a guitar in my life, and I don't know the first thing about playing a guitar, but I listen to what sounds good FOR ME. I think it sounds good, so I listen to it. Its his OWN way of interpreting an instrument that anyone can pick up and interpret THEIR OWN way. If everyone played the same every band would suck because everyone would be the same. I know you think he sucks, which gives you another reason to finally give up on them and stop complaining, enjoy the stuff you do and just leave the people who want to enjoy the music for what is is alone. Moving on..how you can honestly say you know that this 1998-2000 rock persona is the "true" her with a straight face is beyond me when in fact you've never even touched nor seen the woman in your life. Many people have said this before me, but I doubt you'll even pay attention - people change, for goodness sake. When people have babies popping out, obviously your mindset changes. When you take a break from your career and evaluate your life obviously there are parts of you that will change. Thats not to say you can't still have that previous personality that was changed. I, for example LOVED the Spice Girls when they were around. Does that mean I want to be a hardcore Spice Girls fan 7 years later? No, of course not, but I still enjoy their work. Basically, she's not creating your personal tastes. She's making the music for herself, not you, and you can't decide if she's faking herself or not because your opinion relies on blind faith which is just as bad as those fanatical religious maniacs.

I'm done.

When in fact my main shake of faith is the thought that this "persona"wasn't true. Its like someone gives you medical advice, and you find out they weren't really a doctor at all. You'd be irate, no? If you found your doctor working at a shoe shop one day.

You know, I don't consider myself a particularly "tough" critic. I can watch a bad-mediocre movie and be largely positive about it (not always the case, but bare with.) Perhaps I'm a bit more scrupulous with music. It does take a bit much for me to really get behind a whole band. But my "requirements" aren't too tough: have good songs and don't be full of shit -- and the last one can be fenagelled a bit. Not every song on MM is "perfect" but the songs are still great.

Now to say that Uki's guitar is nit-picky is really reaching. If that's the case, the entire forum was nit-picky at a point =P

Has anyone watched School of Rock, with Jack Black? The way he talks about music and rock is pretty much exactly what I believe. The writer mighta called me up, asked me about music, then educed amnesia in me, because its the truth. His character is a loser, no one takes him seriously, he's not a guy that people take very seriously. But what happens in the end? He doesn't win, but he makes somethin' happen. And that's what it's all about. (Its a good movie too, and don't even argue that. =P)

I mean that you can tell if something is well composed or if someone actually took time to make something new instead of just producing some crap to sell to the dumb masses. I don't understand how people like metal either, but I don't think its hard to see how people like uki.

It's like NIHM said, that is who she was THEN. People don't stay the same forever.

People mature, people break habits (or try to), however you guys make it seem going from Charlie Manson to Mother Teresa is in the realm of possibility. People may even radically change a kind of temperament given a huge life changing experience, but they don't become different people. They don't change their insides unless they weren't projecting their guts to begin with.

If birthing a child a life changing experience? Yes. Going from MM to EM/DO Shiina, certainly. However, such a...delayed change? Writing off the very stuff that got her the ability to make a song like Kono yo ni and not have it laughed out of the exec office? If that Shiina what made MM was in fact "real," she would not have disowned her other works, pretend it wasn't really her that made it. She seemed to have some conviction.

EDIT: Just to see if I can draw him to the thread, Maou's take on the single was the funniest "review" I've heard yet, but I won't steal his thunder ;)

1998 SR = 20 years old.
2007 SR = 29 years old.

That's a big difference. I know dudes who used to go to parties, get wasted, sleep around, take them drugs. Now they say that it was all really stupid and they won't be a part of it (you can agree or disagree with that; it's not the point I'm trying to get across). Their personalities haven't changed, but they're not crazy, angry kids anymore. A couple of them have families, and their outlook on life isn't all about pleasing themselves anymore. They've matured. I'm not claiming that this is the case for Ringo, because I really don't know, but this kind of thing is verrrry natural. Paul McCartney has changed. Now he sings about old guy stuff. Billy Corgan changed when he went to Zwan. Actually, that's a really good example. You know exactly what I'm talking about Jihad, so I won't elaborate. ;)

Lol mods, changed this thread's name to "Jihad vs the world".

I seem to be losing you guys. What I'm talking about is philosophical differences, like her self. I understand thats still vague, but i'm not meaning "growing up and not wanting to do keggers anymore.

As for Zwan, Billy didn't really change with Zwan. He was still the same Billy that was fagging around in a dress with the pumpkins. He was just writing different kind of songs (which I thought were fantastic, but whatever.) He didn't say "Oh, The pumpkins were stupid and I was just doing it to do this" He didn't cast Siamese Dream into a flame, he wasn't "someone else" he was still Billy Corgan (for better or worse.) There was no Old Billy v. Nu Billy. Nor even a Young Paul v. New Paul (really).

That could be the case for every Shiina related thread I post in. (Which is why I generally stay out now, but this got inadvertently dragged out.)

Though Paul does admit that he's changed, and he's definitely matured. I doubt he'll be writing another "Why Don't We Do it in the Road," nor does it seem like he'd have any desire to do so.

I'm convinced someone in this thread never leaves their house. :o

Do we need to pass around a peace pipe....lol


everybody hatin'
we really just have to wait and see what happens w the new cd.

I'm amazed about how much you guys are typing in a post. I couldnt sit still that long. I'd die of hunger first.
All I say is not to rush to judge the cd when you havent heard it and at the same time, from what I've heard, it's just different.
Sometimes, change is good. Love man. Love.

I don't think you're losing anybody. I'm sure we're all aware of your meaning. We're trying to say that personality (which includes philosophies one holds) is not constant. It doesn't even have to take a major life event; it just takes a simple change of environment. There is -nothing- about the self that is concrete. Yes, there are some people who are more stable than others in that regard, but that's only because they either refuse to change, or they are content with who they are. But neither of those reasons to be stable are necessarily good or bad . It really depends on the situation.

Maybe to clarify your point, you can tell us what specifically Shiina has done to make it seem like she was "fake"? Is it a musical direction change? Image change? Politics change? Temperament change?

The only way I would consider her "fake" is if she didn't actually write any of her music/lyrics. Everything else about her concerning her image and her musical direction is just her art of creating personas. Those personas are not really her, yes, but they satisfy what she craves: To be different. And that's who she is.

When did she ever say that she never wanted to make her old music? Where does this idea that she "disowned" her other works come from?

Guess I'm not the only person who thinks everyone else is bullying Jihad.

And really, I don't think more than five people of the 300ish members of EMF are jaded Jihen fans like Jihad and I (and Maou but he's MIA). I was willing to accept Ukigumo before adult just because I had *some* faith in SR's choices in men, no, guitarists but after adult there is just no way I can tolerate this guy being in the band anymore, especially now since SR is delegating so much of the songwriting to him.

Just for clarification, where did this whole "fake apple real apple" thing come about from? Some kind of TJ interview that I missed? I'd like to know the source before commenting if Jihad is really being a little too serious about this situation.

For the record, being different is so 1999. Right now it's "in" to be compassionate and eco-minded. Oh, and to be incomprehensible and random too. [/unfounded observations by JR]

I think that everything I don't like is either

done for the money

done to get a cool clishe image

done with passion, but just bad.

Uki would fit in the third categorie. But I somehow also know that I'm not right.


@The Jihad discussion

Yeah, it seemed to me as if Jihad had a source where she actually said all this. But I don't know if I remember that correctly

Let´s hear Shiina

from Sigma

`You say I betray you
that I’m always changing
When all I really do
is not stay true to your illusions`

I think its hilarious how i'm off the forum for the release of Killer Tune, come back, and this is started. I'm so happy you all hate the new work so much (considering it not even hers) and are angry with her recently, maybe if we all get you lucky you will start getting lives and just leave the forum. That would be truly lucky indeed.

^ Here, here kuro_neko.

Beauty before age, Neko =P

Retro-edit: golem: See its like clockwork that Neko tells me to leave =P

Retro-edit deux: Ya really like fixin' on the Pixar thing, don't ya? That's so strange to me =p And since you're not referring to "someone like me" in the "you all" as you say, does that mean you wish me to stay?:wub:

déjà vu?

did you see Tokyo Jihad addressed ANYWHERE in my last post?

NO

if I recall I said "you all"

so get back to your precious Pixar and don't delude yourself to think I was referring to someone like you.

Your definition of "you all" was "all the people that hate her recently". And there is only one, and that's Jihad. Or at least it includes Jihad. Do you really want to deny that?

Or otherwise "you all" would have no decision which means... you want to be alone in this forum?

Do it like me, don't take all this more serious than in the post we are talking about =P

The Number of the Beast

For once, I'm not going to completely agree with Jihad. I mean, times change and we with time. I don't think she was ever faking anything. For whatever reason she doesn't seem to want to be the person she once was. She was a rock goddess at the top of of her game, but something changed her. For better or worse, this is who she is. I don't care for current persona, but it's as real as any other musician.

True Story

I don't even know why I wrote in this thread. When, in the history of the internet, has there ever been an argument that ended with one party saying to the other party "You know what? Your opposing view has helped me understand that I was mistaken. You were right, and I was wrong. I have therefore changed my views and look forward to more stimulating discussion in future. Good day to you, sir/madam."

Never.

you know, thats an interesting thought, kprov.

But we do it anyway. Idont think so much that we want to change the other person's mind. Maybe we just wanna match-up our logic. See who is "sounder."

(at that note, I don't make claim that I'm more logical -- I fully know my take is the least logical (as long as its beyond "that song sucks.") But music isn't about logic, now is it)

I dunno, interesting thought to bring up.

Oh I'v done things like that.
In my german board I managed to end discussion over certain things with just one post. Until then they were arguing in one direction and then in the other, going in circles without understanding each other at all.
I still know how I explained the difference between the end of Neon Genesis Evangelion and the ending of the movies. Oh and there was a discussion about elitegamer that I stopped.
Before my post there were about 30+ posts a day in the threads, and then they just suddenly stopped or went back to topic.

On topic now ^_^

Don't be discouraged NIMH. People post to make their voices heard. But many other people just read. To learn. It's the readers who will be influenced by posts as well written as yours, because they are reading with an open mind and not because they have something to say. You'll probably never get the response you mentioned, written and posted as a reply. But I assure you millions have changed their thinking after just reading this vast resource called the Internet.

On topic: Defining a personality based on musical genre is a very strange thing to do. Instead, look at lifestyle, personal interactions, maybe her lyrics. But genre?

In my view, SR is one of the rare artists who has kept it real. Most artists are limited by their labels, their fans, or by their own capabilities to always express the same thing. If SR wants to express something new, something different, then she does, and she does it well. She's got musical wanderlust, she's curious, and she has a work ethic. And in that she has been consistent throughout her career.

This is a GREAT point, Zach. Ringo WAS influenced by her fans when they told her that they liked music written by other members, and instead of writing something she did not believe in, she kept it real and stayed out of the composing aspect and still gave the fans what they wanted. Now we can only look forward to their next album with even more fervor. :)

This is hilarious. Whose philosophy? I think you'll find it's yours and always was. 'Artistic trust'? What you have is either liking the music or not. Everything else is you speculating about the intentions and personality of a total stranger. Plus a lot of feelings.

Nobody gives a fuck about what that guy says.

LOL
It's so funny that after 11 years this thread is still relevant
my 2007 self would cry for daaaaaysssss if she knew that

All the complaints here seem like child's play compared to what a monster Ringo has become after 2015 (lol?)

I've mellowed in the last, let's check this thread date, 11 years Fauxie. You're right there's a fair bit of projection that goes on in fandoms. I don't think that's necessarily wrong. I don't even think it's wrong to feel upset if an artist starts making things that seem anathema to what you previously enjoyed.


Are you just looking for things to get upset or feel superior about? I'll save your the trouble, they're there.


On a lighter note, when i saw this thread title, I thought, what's DG on about now? Boy was I embarrassed :lol:

I know, I know, it's from years ago. Apologies for being a bit of a dick with my tone. Not consciously looking to get upset or feel superior about something. I know it's a bit odd for you guys as this is old hat to you, a thread from ages ago, but the forum's new to me and I've been going through all the old threads in the main forum, seeing what fans were thinking at various times about different albums and whatnot. It's fascinating, I have to say.

I imagine It's very entertaining, especially the time when some people got banned by the late admin who shall not be named because they didn't like ukigumo XD

Oh wait, this was at the old Ringo Jihen forums
can we still have access to that?

Just reread this thread and it's interesting to get perspective from 12 years ago since this was literally around the time I was discovering Shiina Ringo. I think 2007 is probably the worst creative year in her entire career (I'll fight you, DG) so no wonder EMF sounded the alarm so quickly.

But I would like to just say this. I think we can all agree that if Ringo were still trying to replicate the "shock value" of Honnou 20 years later it would be a pretty depressing timeline to live in. Probably worse than the "release a couple singles and create a patchwork album" one we live in now.

Let me use an example. Remember seeing Harrison Ford again in "The Force Awakens"? A lot of people were excited. I thought we'd see some character progression myself. "I wonder what he's up to now?" we all asked ourselves, eagerly anticipating the movie's release. Well, turns out he's still a smuggler. He's just a lot older now. And looking a lot more tired. And god, that was depressing as shit. Aren't you supposed to learn when you get older? Aren't you supposed to change and get better? Or at least get wiser?

Well, you definitely grew up, Jihad. We all did. And for better or worse, Ringo did too.

I just wish she would reinvent herself in an exciting way instead of releasing boring stuff =_=
Madonna did it back in the 90s, why can't Ringo?

She covers all that musical ground and does it authentically across most styles she goes for, I'd say. Most versatile female composer of all time (can argue about how highly you rate the compositions, of course). Singular skill set/accomplishments among female artists because no females with similar skills have been quite such proper posters on walls kind of pop icons, I don't think.