Third album: Variety [News]

[kuro_neko]

honestly it depends on the person, I don't meant to imply that every person who works in customer relations in Japan can help you out in English. I guess more often than not they just do their best to try and help you out, and if your of European descent racially speaking, I think the standard assumption is you speak English.

I know some people who are white and grew up in Japan with Japanese as their first language and stuff still happens to them. Sometimes I would go out with friends who were in same program as me who were Korean or Chinese and just starting Japanese and the waitstaff would always send questions their direction if no one said a word.

but then again, if you just speak up in Japanese and show them your capable they drop all that. What really pisses me off is when you see people not even make an effort, tourists who just come and bark English and then get angry when ;;gasp;; someone in a FOREIGN COUNTRY doesn't speak ENGLISH omg, end of the world.

But I still think assuming people in Japan don't know a fairly large English vocabulary, incapsulating the word "adult" is a little off base. I guess a similar example would be like some words from Spanish that everyone knows in the States, iunno.

[frecklegirl]

whoa, a whole debate happened without me there.

ShadyNook, apparently you are incapable of reading. Just understand this:
1) Ringo herself pronounces it "Adaruto." Any Japanese fan of hers also most likely understands it is said "Adaruto," REGARDLESS of their impulse to call it "Otona." (I bet some fans have been corrected, too... ha!)
2) We're not saying translate everything. We're saying go by what we're indicated to pronounce it as.

Why, I ask of you, are you blowing this out of proportion? We say "Pronounce the album titles like the katakana indicates, not the kanji." You say "OMGWTF THIS FORUM MAKES ME TRANSLATE EVERYTHING SHIINA APPLE TOKYO INCIDENTS BLAH BLAH OMG OMG."

If you've really taken 3 years of Japanese, don't you understand the concept of furigana by now? seriously. o_o

[newyorkjihen]

I'm scared of you guys. I hope no one hear ever hears me mispronounce an album title, because I would fear for my safety. So can I call it "Adult" or do I have to pronounce it like "Adaruto"?

Originally Posted by shadyNook

and its clear as day on the Adult album cover and Shuraba single that the only name the band can be called, by the rule, is "Tokyo Incidents"

Uh oh. We have a problem here... anxiety levels rising... beads of sweat forming... Does it really matter? Adult-Adaruto-Otona-大人... Why can't we just use them interchangeably? What about the Shéna problem? Doesn't it suggest that she is interested in linguistics? Doesn't it imply that language and translations are imperfect, and what really matters is the meaning that is conveyed?

Originally Posted by Tokyo Jihad

Shiina Apple is down right silly.

Phew. Anxiety levels dropping. Shiina Apple IS downright silly. But I'd kind of like to call her "Miss Apple" from now on. Yes, I know Shiina is her family name. I just think Miss Apple is sort of cute. I want to be downright silly.

[elodie]

OMG ! STOP IT YOU GUYS! THIS IS SO STUPID !
Who cares it its pronouced as adult or otona! Just prounce it as how you like it to pronouce it ! It's not like we're going to go and prounce her album title ou there! It's the music that counts ! I can't believe you people...........all these debate are so meaningless....

[Tokyo Jihad]

You can go to a record shop in Japan and pick up "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely hearts Club Band." Chances are, im fairly sure, the japanese edition on the side has the title "translated" in kana/kanji. However, this doesn't mean the album is called anything other than "Sgt Pepper's..."

Just like if, I dunno, Bjork released an album in america, and it had an Icelandic title (and maybe she has in fact, I don't know.) The title of that album referred to as that Icelandic title, not some American translation concoction.

I don't see how this is a difficult concept....we're just saying "call stuff what its called on the damn disc/covers/jackets."

[newyorkjihen]

Originally Posted by Tokyo Jihad

Just like if, I dunno, Bjork released an album in america, and it had an Icelandic title (and maybe she has in fact, I don't know.)

Yes, Bjork's "Gling Glo" means "tick tock" in English. And it's an awesome record (import only). And I don't call it "tick tock". But Tokyo Incidents... ? Too confusing for me. Too much stress.

What about Prince, the artist formerly known as an unpronounceable symbol? He's back to Prince... I think... not like anyone ever stopped calling him that.

[Tokyo Jihad]

"Tokyo Incidents" is some retcon. Tokyo Jihen is what they're "really" called.

And obviously Prince is a an extenuating circumstance =p

[ShadyNook]

Originally Posted by frecklegirl

don't you understand the concept of furigana by now? seriously. o_o

yes here's an example:

大人 = おとな (read as "Otona")
アダルト = Adoruto = Adult

That's the hard rule thats existed before that album, heck, even before any of us were born.

Furigana's function is to help children and Japanese language students learn the pronunciation of new or difficult kanji by breaking it/them down into hiragana. It is definitely not an aid to translating kanji.

She calls it Adult, thats fine. English words make a product seem cooler, I guess. She knows she has alot of international fans. But even Ringo doesn't have the ability to alter furigana's purpose.

If I were to romanize or pronounce 大人 as "adult" on a test or quiz. I'd have an automatic error. If I were correcting your quiz and you wrote that, I'd pull out my red pen.

The majority of Japanese adults and grade schoolers can read katakana. If TJ's 2nd album was strictly meant to be known as Adult and nothing else, that kanji would not and should not be there. A bottle of Tide detergent would not have the kanji for "ocean waves" 風潮 next to Tide in katakana. That product is strictly "Tide."

If I were that albums graphic designer, I'd have a good laugh at all this nonsense.

[Tokyo Jihad]

Originally Posted by ShadyNook

But even Ringo doesn't have the ability to alter furigana's purpose.

Originally Posted by kuro_neko

this entire debate is rather pointless. I mean, going back to KZK, you don't read it karuki seieki kuri no hana (as the kanji would be read), since she created a kanji compound for Kalk, reads "semen" instead of "seieki" (which is the correct reading for that kanji compound" and kuri no hana is left unaltered. Then look at Ichijiku no Hana. The real kanji for ichijiku is 無花果, or the fruit without a flower, XD (thanks host mom!!!!) and not the kanji compound she created.

That being said, anyone who chooses to call Adult "Otona" is completely daft. Regardless of the kanji, it has clearly been labeled "Adult" and this new album will be Variety, regardless of the new kanji.

10 chars..

[ShadyNook]

artistic licence in that case. In Otona's case, simply a translation.

Theres no obscure meaning. Theres no concept to be read into.

Kaban no Nakami is also Crosswalk. Shuraba; The Rats Nest, Scene of Carnage.

Ringo is flexible with words. Very flexible. Would she be offended if I called the 2nd album ""Otona" right in front of her or correct me? I doubt that.