[SR] 2009.06.24 - Sanmon Gossip (CD) [Album]

[cjhobbies00]

Originally Posted by Entry№1

@cjhobbies: Not to argue your show of respect, but yo be fair, even those things can change. I live in an area of America greatly affected by the "obesity epidemic" and yet I've still met a lot of people who have drastically changed their bodies for the better. Luckily for Ringo, she would never have to undergo such a transformation, except for maybe having to put on weight to counter her mal-absorption problems. I agree with you in the sense that it's insensitive to talk bad about someone's body, just as it is insensitive to talk bad about someone's house. It's where they live, it's who they are. But the fact remains that it can change, and for some reason that fact disturbs people.

Physical appearances change, we get old and we get wrinkles and add on weight and so on. Criticizing about weight and the shape of someone's face (though I think it's ok if you want to point out that it appears different then it has in the past) is rather shallow of us; our physical traits are often beyond our control...including our weight.

Makeup, costuming, and sets are open to criticism because those are artistic decisions that Shiina made personally.

[kuro_neko]

you know what, I can't honestly say I have read every nuiance of what has been posted. It seems the longer we bat this tennis ball back and forth the longer the posts get (and less interest most of us have) so I will try to respond with a short curt answer.

fact of the matter, the way we treat Ringo *as her fans* is bullshit. when male artists come out with music videos and promos for new work we don't find ourselves dissecting who has collagen, who got air brushed, who's boobs look saggy, who has bad make-up, who "doesn't know him(self)" anymore, blah blah the list goes on and on.

if you want to say the music is shit, go ahead. I will disagree and we might get into a discussion about personal tastes. Want to talk about Ringo's image and promo and nudity, no problem. But when it degrades into saggy tits and collagen, I'm out.

What is the exact problem here anyways? I haven't personally attached any of you or called you a rapist or a misogynist directly. I am saying that these types of comments that are taking over this thread, THEY are (at times) misogynistic and IMPO unacceptable. so I'm going to stand up for nekkid Ringo.

@Cosmo....I will forever have Tarzan and Jane by Toy Box in my head now...hahah, thanks.

[Osiris12345]

I feel like bringing personal appearance into this is justification to complain about things that don't really matter. I think her music is good enough to sustain itself without having to rely on her image. I don't look at that as insulting to fashion designers or makeup artists. Her music is just more important to me. Sorry to anyone else who feels differently. Ringo is a musician, first and foremost.

Originally Posted by kuro_neko

fact of the matter, the way we treat Ringo *as her fans* is bullshit. when male artists come out with music videos and promos for new work we don't find ourselves dissecting who has collagen, who got air brushed, who's boobs look saggy, who has bad make-up, who "doesn't know him(self)" anymore, blah blah the list goes on and on.

I find it sadly ironic that Shiina Ringo released an album with herself completely nude and exposed at a time when criticism against her is at its strongest. It's like she's saying "Well, here I am. This is me." and so many choose to throw more insults at her. People bitch about the collagen, how she sold out, the makeup, or how she looks like a slut. They look at the superficial details. All the superficial gossip. How fitting it is that she released an album with that title.

Just something to think about.

[kuro_neko]

well in japan people don't have that image of her. if anything they think back to her early days when she was misunderstood, they thought she was a cosplayer, or a prostitute, even a scary woman who scribbled spells on the floor under her bed (I have noooo idea where people got that idea...). I think since she was essentially reclaiming her solo name with this album she was kind of presenting herself up to everyone as is, no complications and nothing to be confused or misunderstand, just pure Ringo. Obviously this album is quite different from what she did previously so in a way this was her reclaiming her own title, Superficial Gossip fits into it perfectly as well.

[mizer_unmei]

Hear hear about the whole appearance issue.

People always judge women more critically. And ugly or overweight woman is much less acceptable, especially in the media, than men. I would love for Ringo to just go Patti Smith on us and try to break social stereotypes. But she is a visual person and seems to like using herself as another expression. She likes looking girly and sophisticated and I love her for doing that.

However much she changes in appearance doesn't matter just as long as she's doing what she wants to, you have to respect her.

[Tokyo Jihad]

Christ Neko, wtf have you been on the last couple of days? you're calling me out on the subject of her appearance?? The kind of discussions I stay out of, if not admonish? In this single thread I said ONE thing on the subject, and that had more to do with the overall feel of the Ryuukou pv rather than catty, Chelsea Lately type mouth farting.

Its like youre upset and pissed about something and you can't not feel that somehow I have something to do with it. Fuck off. If you're on your rag, keep me and the forum free of it.

[Positron]

Originally Posted by Scribble R

I would never show that PV to anyone. It's embarassing because it seems like a poor imitation of the horrible, vain pop music videos in the West. I suppose that she's done just as embarrassing videos in her genius days, though. Dynamite PV, for instance =X

Funny you should say that, I showed it to someone and got this response:

"The man creeped me out (he kept touching himself); the music though was A-OK and the woman was quite attractive."

Maybe we're used to something moderately atypical of mainstream, but I can't fault her here if what she's doing is still able to pull people in and have them enjoy her music. Maybe there's no glass breaking super banquet white-out rage here, but man, when she breaks into a charge along the runway and ramps up the energy with the song, it's hella fie--- uh, intense, and I think we can at least still appreciate that she's willing to show that in some form other than her vocals.

Had ShinjiPG directed the video, telling Ringo to gloss her duck lips and drop some ass volcanoes on Mummy-D, I'd definitely be with you on the sentiment as a brother-in-arms. Well, after laugh-crying.

[s3r3nity]

On a positive note...
Although I only watched it twice, every time I listen to Vogue now, I picture Ringo walking down the catwalk in beat. +1 for the PV for going well with the music at least, and creating an association. It could've been a lot cooler, but hey, she still has 2 more to prove to us she's still got it.

[frecklegirl]

Originally Posted by Osiris12345

I personally hate the Tsumi to Batsu video. I think it's boring, lifeless, and overall muted in comparison to the crazyness that is the single. It's basically just Ringo sitting in a car singing and driving in it occasionally. It completely lacks the classic Ringo creativity of the Yami ni Furu Ame and Gibs videos. When the music gets frantic, the video doesn't. She pulls out a sword and then does nothing with it. It doesn't seem to mesh well with Tsumi to Batsu at all. Notice how I didn't mention her appearance in the video at all. I could go on about how bad her makeup looks but to me it's a moot point. It's trying to make a mountain out of a molehill. Makeup does not a good PV make. What matters to me is how well the concept is executed.

Ahhhh. You described my exact thoughts perfectly. I have only watched that video once because I was like WHAT THE HELL IS THIS BORING CRAP?!

[Scribble R]

There's no point in really continuing this argument. The people that are going STOP ATTACKING SHIINA'S BODY! STOP BEING SO MISOGYNISTIC! are arguing with straw men, and don't want to listen, despite me saying over and over and over again that it isn't Shiina herself that is being criticised, it's the way she presents herself in this video. No-one is saying that Shiina is an ugly woman, no-one at all. And no-one thinks that her physical appearance is more important than her music.

But to suggest that there isn't a heavy visual element to Shiina Ringo is a bit stupid, especially with all the costume changes and wigs and photoshoots. So she's fair game.

It was a stylistic choice for Shiina to look like that in the video. And she is extremely prominent in it. The whole POINT of a music video is to add a visual element on top of the music.

What's so fucking difficult to understand about that?